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Post by whatif on Jun 10, 2017 0:09:24 GMT -6
There's another at the 20:25 mark that is amazing!
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Post by watchmanjim on Jun 10, 2017 7:04:17 GMT -6
I have seen pictures of many of them before, Whatif. People doubt whether they're real, but there are so many of them in the world!
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Post by Jackson on Jun 10, 2017 14:31:36 GMT -6
I've done a bit of research on the book of Enoch and a whole lot of praying. It is a very intriguing book and kind of scary in a sense. Not sure to believe it or not but It does have a lot of backup spiritually. The Bible says to test those things with the Spirit. Not many people have ever even heard of the book. Most come to find it when looking for something deeper. The Bible itself has all one NEEDS to know. But it also says to ask and we shall receive. Search and we shall find. To me, you really have to let the Spirit guide you in your reading of Enoch or it may lead you in a wrong direction. Truth seeker is better at typing, hopefully she can add to this or help get my message across. I'm going to try to add a YouTube link that I found to be very interesting. The guy can be kinda out there sometimes and I think it's just his personality. I do disagree with some of his thoughts but he is on to some things. Helped me get a better idea or viewpoint on a bunch of things. I DO highly suggest that those of you out there that feel safe with your faith and feel that you can stay on the straight and narrow to at least hear his thoughts. Nothing is concrete, but does raise several "whoa" and "that makes a lot of sense" moments for me. Lastly, If y'all haven't looked into who put the Bible together, you may check that out. I have always thought that God left the scriptures in the care of the Jews, but later reread to see that it was the "oracles" of God entrusted to them. That's verbal, not written. Hope this brings more discussion!!! God Bless!!!!!!
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Post by watchmanjim on Jun 10, 2017 14:41:08 GMT -6
There are some things in the book that make me think, there has to be something to it. One of my biggest warnings about it is, that in such an extensive and expository book, there seems to be no mention of Satan, and that confuses me. It has been a while since I read the whole thing through, but to me, leaving him out seemed like a conspicuous absence. Maybe I would see more about him if I went back and reread it now.
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Post by Jackson on Jun 10, 2017 18:55:28 GMT -6
Good point watchmanjim. I'll have to look into that one.
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Post by Jackson on Jun 10, 2017 19:02:01 GMT -6
This is that link about Enoch's writing that I found first and got me started on the book.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2017 20:59:34 GMT -6
Jackson, I have not read the book of Enoch. You would know more than me on that one!
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Post by watchmanjim on Jun 10, 2017 22:02:04 GMT -6
My first read-through, which was a number of years ago now, had me feeling that some parts of it were very profoundly genuine on some level, while other parts seemed like the "Jewish fables" we are warned not to heed. Some of it seemed like it was new information that could not have been known apart from God, and other parts copied or made up by narcissistic rabbis passing off their clever revisionist fiction as divinely inspired revelation--for instance, many of the prophesies from Enoch's time-point would clearly have come to pass by the intertestamental time period (circa 300 BC) when some people suspect this book was actually written.
The one reference that chilled me to the bone was the concept of the "Seven Spirits of God," which term I find nowhere in the Bible except Revelation. A close second was the presentation of the preincarnate Son of Man--a glimpse of whom we have, perhaps, with Daniel, but nowhere else so vivid.
Mathematical and scientific problems abounded in the book--for instance, Enoch still being on earth after the birth of Noah, whereas the Genesis chronology indicates he was taken prior to Noah's birth. Etc.
It is important to realize the book was written in at least 5 distinct parts, and I suspect these five parts may have had different authorship. The part Jude quoted was clearly legit. Jude's integrity as a Spirit-led Scripture writer demands that those 2 verses be authentic.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2017 7:10:58 GMT -6
After my husband researched again, reading Genesis 1-4 again, we believe the book of Enoch was not included in the Bible because there was 'ANOTHER' Enoch who was the child of Cain! That's why all of you have said that it must be carefully read with a God seeking mind! 😃 He was of a non God-fearing line, cursed. If you read, it is not until Seth comes along that a God -fearing line begins, and the Enoch WE KNOW as of concerning 'walking with God', and the Father of Methusaleh. Maybe God did not want the low-info reader to be confused or led away by this book of Enoch, as there were TWO Enoch's(!)  ? |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2017 7:36:54 GMT -6
Maybe satan added to the book, because he would use the truth about AN Enoch and blended it with the one that God wanted us to focus on.
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Post by Jackson on Jun 11, 2017 7:47:01 GMT -6
Watchmanjim, you are a much better writer than I am, lol!!! What you wrote is pretty much the same thing I feel. Wish I had better thought to pen abilities, haha. But yes, many things seem legit but then many sound like made up jargon. I feel that I can see where things have been added simply by following the spiritual meaning of the text. Like when Enoch said his grandson (Noah) called out for him to help him and then he came and spoke to him. Sounds cool, but I don't think someone that follows God calls on anyone else besides God. Not pushing, but has anyone watched that video yet? It adds some geographical evidence for Enoch.
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Post by watchmanjim on Jun 11, 2017 10:55:54 GMT -6
I have not had a chance to watch it yet, unless it's one I've watched before.
Truthseeker, I'll have to consider what you said some more--I'm pretty sure the Enoch referred to in this book is supposed to be the Enoch we all know and love, who was the great-grandfather of Noah. This is the Enoch that Jude identifies specifically-- "Enoch, the seventh from Adam."
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Post by Deleted on Jun 11, 2017 12:02:29 GMT -6
Genesis 4:17Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
17 And Cain knew his wife; and she conceived, and bare Enoch: and he builded a city, and called the name of the city, after the name of his son, Enoch.
Genesis 5:18Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
18 And Jared lived an hundred sixty and two years, and he begat Enoch:
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Post by disciple4life on Oct 30, 2017 7:28:29 GMT -6
The reason the Jude verses bring intrigue to the Nephilim discussion is because Jude appears to be quoting directly from the forbidden book of Enoch. That third-rail document was found, among other places, in the Dead Sea Scrolls, and is and has been continually used by certain African church groups to this day as if it were canonical scripture. But I have read the translation, and much of it seems extremely far-fetched and even scientifically impossible, and spiritually problematic, to the point it could not have been (in my opinion) directly inspired by the Holy Spirit. Like many of the other non-canonical books, it smacks of "Jewish Fables" and can't be given even the historical credence of Josephus's works or the books of Maccabees (which of course cannot claim inspiration, or infallibility). The controversial so-called Book of Enoch, among other things, gives its author(s?)' opinion or imagination of what the Genesis 6 fiasco might have looked like. Let's just say I've seen Disney movies that stood up to a lot more scrutiny than the Book of Enoch. But much of the "information" you will find about the Genesis 6 account is influenced, directly, or indirectly, from the Book of Enoch perspective, which in my opinion is unfortunate. On the other hand, Jude quotes two verses from the work and thereby inserts those two verses into cannonical Scripture, thereby verifying their authority and/or authenticity. Or. . . . is it possibly the other way around, that Enoch quoted Jude? Every history authority says Book of Enoch was written first, especially since the Dead Sea Scrolls are assumed to have been stashed before Christ's death (and probably before His birth). Hello Brothers and sisters, I've been very fascinated with the whole theme of Noah and Lot and how these two together hold some key to the return of the Lord (I mean the whole string of end-times, not the second coming only). I just found this thread by whatif. This is just one perspective watchmanjim. It's not my original thought, but i don't remember who said it first -- It's possible that Jude is not actually quoting from the Book of Enoch, (which is not part of the Cannon, and not inspired/ controversial to say the least) but rather simply restating his prophecy. Big difference. We know Enoch was a OT saint who walked with God, and is only one of two who were 'translated' did not see death. I mean, it's possible that Enoch was a great Saint/ Prophet, and a strong candidate for one of the Two Witnesses, but the Book of Enoch was - His own real writings/ but not inspired by the Holy Spirit, and therefore have errors / Not part of the Cannon or
- The Book of Enoch was all a hoax, -invented and written by someone else, who used/ attached his name. ??
Just my take. I'm trying to look objectively at this Noah/Lot connection. I think there's something very significant about the fact that these two are listed together and connected with the return of Christ. Noah and Lot have almost nothing in common. Just trying to think out loud.  Look at different angles. - Noah's Flood was Global, Destruction of Sodom was one specific city.
- Sodom was sexually immoral / homosexuality but probably lots of depravity - With Noah, the whole earth was exceedingly wicked. No one specific sin was mentioned.
- In Both Noah and Lot - the righteous were warned. Spared.
- In the story of Lot, it was two angels/ messengers. In the story of Noah, God himself warned Noah.
- Neither story has any connection to a Feast.
- In one story, we are given a month and day for Noah's flood, but nothing regarding Lot.
- In the Lot story, even Lot's future sons-in-law were warned. ?? Believers/ righteous ?? but for some reason, they ignored it - didn't leave with Lot and his family. In Noah's case, he was warned 7 days before and the righteous were spared. Both cases - the righteous were warned and spared, taken out before destruction.
- Or Is it that in both cases - people were just doing life?? - the 'cares of this world', building their new "Chariot repair" business, or distracted by riches, greed, idolatry, social media, - oh wait.
- If that's all it was, people not listening to Prophets - consumed with stuff of life - why these two specific cities, when countless cities have been destroyed. ?? Jericho comes to mind. But then, we have Rahab, who was listed in the Roll-call of saints, in Hebrews - Her faith/obedience was credited to her as righteousness. hmmm.
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Post by disciple4life on Oct 30, 2017 7:52:17 GMT -6
This video,for what it's worth. . . Hello whatif, watchmanjim, The link is not available, not working. Says there was a copyright claim. ;-( Can you give the exact title, or post another link?? D4L
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?
Look at different angles.