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Post by venge on Jun 24, 2019 6:39:25 GMT -6
Nope, you cannot trick me.
Rev 17 states: 11And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition
This 4rth beast that becomes the 8th is of the 7 previous heads. As all 5 heads were slain and it existed before Rome, when it comes back it becomes the 8th head.
Rev 17:9-11 state the 7 heads are mountains, which are kingdoms, and the heads are also kings/leaders. 5 kings fell which are also 5 kingdoms and 5 heads. One kingdom is Rome, Rome’s leader and it is the 6th head. The 7th head comes after Rome which is a different kingdom and a king.
The beast slain before Rome with its king does not exist when Rome ruled. This is the 8th head/kingdom/and king. The 4rth beast per Dan 7:23 is a kingdom ruled by a man. Not a Resurrected man. How many heads does a man have?
Rev 13:3
3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed:
Not a man, a kingdom.
23Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth
The false prophet causes all to worship the 4th beast which is the 8th head which is a kingdom.
The kingdom that returns existed before Rome making it not Rome.
Rev 17 is very specific. Do you not recall how once all 7 heads are slain the beast is dead yet the kingdoms live on holding the name of blasphemy without reigning? Yet one head resurrects and causes the beast to live with 6 dead heads. So this head that thought to be dead becomes the 8th. If 2 kingdoms/2 kings/which are 2 heads comes after Rome, it isn’t Rome.
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Post by davewatchman on Jun 24, 2019 10:48:47 GMT -6
Nope, you cannot trick me. That's good to know. For after all, this does call for a mind with wisdom. And it does imply that there IS trickery afoot. He will deceive the many, if possible, even the elect. Rev 17 states: 11And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition This is talking about the Devil himself. One of the four beasts in Revelation is the great red dragon. It's the Devil's theocratic one world religious state. I think we're in it now. He snuck it in and did it by working behind the scenes using the composite beast as his proxy. To it he gives his power and his throne and his great authority. This is the beast, the Devil, that once WAS VISIBLE, back in the garden. Now he is NOT VISIBLE. And he will soon become VISIBLE once again just before Jesus comes back and then go to his perdition destruction. With none to help him. This 4rth beast that becomes the 8th is of the 7 previous heads. That sounds close enough. But the 8th is of the 7. He is of the same kind, with a blasphemous name written on his head. The 8th is the last and final one world theocratic government. A politico / religious state. As all 5 heads were slain and it existed before Rome, when it comes back it becomes the 8th head. Nope, they were't slain. It never says they were slain. It says they were fallen. Five are fallen. All 5 are here with us now. Have you heard of the phrase: "fallen woman"? Is a fallen woman, a slain woman? No. She's just fallen from grace, or proved false. In AD 95, Jesus' birth, death, and resurrection, proved the five previous religious belief systems false. One hint is that each of these heads have a "blasphemous" name written on them. That should point us to them having something to do with religion. And then how the Historicists have identified the Papacy as being the "head" that was healed from a mortal wound that was struck in 1798, should send us on a search for the six other belief systems. If the Papacy IS the 6th head, the other heads must be something of the same KIND. And with Protestantism not having come yet in AD 95, and now having been here for just a short time, the picture looks complete now. Louis-Alexandre Berthier
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia Check out the Wiki note. I like them because they should be unbiased. Military Careeren.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis-Alexandre_Berthier#Military_careerScroll down to the third paragraph in the link. A major blow. Bang bang Maxwell's silver hammer came down upon his head. Bang bang Maxwell's silver hammer made sure he was dead. "After a torturous journey under Berthier's supervision, the pope died, dealing a major blow to the Vatican's political power. That was his mortal head wound, "a major blow", in 1798. The Vatican remained closed until 1929 when it was opened by Mussolini. And now it's healed from the deadly wound. Can you imagine nowadays if they arrested the Pope and he died in a jail cell. But it happened. And most people aren't connecting the dots. But then did connect the dots right when it was happening though. The reformers saw it. John Calvin saw it. Cotton Mather saw it. They could point right at it and say that's your Huckleberry right there. Because they just finished watching the Dragon chasing the woman through the Foxe Book Days of Europe. 75 to 100 million Christians killed. I mean, they wen't too busy being distracted by their smartphones, caught up in surfeiting, drunkenness and the cares of this life . |
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Post by venge on Jun 24, 2019 14:50:00 GMT -6
I’m sorry, but I don’t follow your opinion.
The devil will be literally seen? He is the beast?
I’m going to part here because we are not going to agree at all. As scripture shows, it is the 4th kingdom. Scripture is specific. I’m not here to make guesses but to examine God’s word and talk about it. Not things outside scripture, guesses, apocrypha, solar charts and patterns, horoscopes and such.
The fact remains that the 8th is identified as of the 7. And all 7 are identified as kingdoms with a ruler and both are the head which makes the 8th the same thing. This is why we have a kingdom that will come and a ruler to rule it, both identified in Revelation
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Post by davewatchman on Jun 24, 2019 17:20:49 GMT -6
I’m sorry, but I don’t follow your opinion. That's OK. No need to apologize. Iv'e been called kooky before. I’m going to part here because we are not going to agree at all. Here we do agree to disagree. The devil will be literally seen? He is the beast? Yes he will. When he rises from the abyss, the man of sin will be revealed. Is this the "man" that made the kingdoms tremble? Yes he is. The Devil is one of the beasts mentioned in Revelation. He is the great red dragon that was cast out from heaven in Revelation 12. And he is the beast that rises from the bottomless pit and makes war on and kills the two witnesses in Revelation 11. "The beast that you saw was, and is not, and is about to rise from the bottomless pit and go to destruction.
"And when they have finished their testimony, the beast that rises from the bottomless pit will make war on them and conquer them and kill them, The beast that rises from the bottomless pit, the abyss, is the Devil, the destroyer. Abaddon means Destroyer in two languages. (Revelation 9:11—"whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, The Angel of Death.") as Ἀβαδδὼν, and then translated ("which in Greek means the Destroyer", Ἀπολλύων, Apollyon).As scripture shows, it is the 4th kingdom. Scripture is specific. I’m not here to make guesses but to examine God’s word and talk about it. Not things outside scripture, guesses, apocrypha, solar charts and patterns, horoscopes and such. I didn't think to check the horoscopes, that's a good one. It says they're 7 kings and seven mountains and seven heads with blasphemous names written on them. Mountains are symbolic for religion or worship. In South America, the pagans would climb up to the top of the mountain top to meet with their deities. Remember the high places from the OT where they set up the asherah poles? An Asherah pole is a sacred tree or pole that stood near Canaanite religious locations to honor the Ugaritic mother-goddess Asherah, consort of El. Remember mount Moriah, the mount of transfiguration and mount Zion? God's Holy Hill? And a "king" is not just a ruler of a nation. King can also mean a thing preeminent in it's class. In the USA Budweiser is the "king' of beers. In Europe, soccer is the "king" of sports. In the middle east, Islam is the "king" of religion. The cattle kings were legendary ranchers of the old west, never mind. The fact remains that the 8th is identified as of the 7. And all 7 are identified as kingdoms with a ruler and both are the head which makes the 8th the same thing. This is why we have a kingdom that will come and a ruler to rule it, both identified in Revelation I can't figure out what makes you think that the 7 heads are kingdoms. If you can understand that the one that IS healed now is the Catholic Church, or the Papacy. The kingdoms on the composite beast are not the 7 heads, the kingdoms on the composite beast are represented by the ten horns. These are ten kings who have not yet received their royal power, but who for one hour, will receive authority as kings along with the beast. I've learned that the word used there for hour is hora, and it probably means a duration of time longer than 60 actual minutes. Maybe a time, maybe a year, maybe a short season. |
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rondonmonson
Truth Seeker
I can do all things through Christ which strengthens me....
Posts: 186
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Post by rondonmonson on Jun 24, 2019 18:22:06 GMT -6
Nope, you cannot trick me. Rev 17 states: 11And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition This 4rth beast that becomes the 8th is of the 7 previous heads. As all 5 heads were slain and it existed before Rome, when it comes back it becomes the 8th head. Rev 17:9-11 state the 7 heads are mountains, which are kingdoms, and the heads are also kings/leaders. 5 kings fell which are also 5 kingdoms and 5 heads. One kingdom is Rome, Rome’s leader and it is the 6th head. The 7th head comes after Rome which is a different kingdom and a king. The beast slain before Rome with its king does not exist when Rome ruled. This is the 8th head/kingdom/and king. The 4rth beast per Dan 7:23 is a kingdom ruled by a man. Not a Resurrected man. How many heads does a man have? Rev 13:3 3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: Not a man, a kingdom. 23Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth The false prophet causes all to worship the 4th beast which is the 8th head which is a kingdom. The kingdom that returns existed before Rome making it not Rome. Rev 17 is very specific. Do you not recall how once all 7 heads are slain the beast is dead yet the kingdoms live on holding the name of blasphemy without reigning? Yet one head resurrects and causes the beast to live with 6 dead heads. So this head that thought to be dead becomes the 8th. If 2 kingdoms/2 kings/which are 2 heads comes after Rome, it isn’t Rome. A Beast is one that Dominates thus its in Juxtaposition to Israel in every instance. Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome were all Kingdoms that Beasted over Israel in some manner or another. Satan assigns Demonic entities over specific areas, that is just fact......Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places....... Satan is shown as a Red Dragon Beast in Rev. 12, with 7 Heads and 10 Horns with Crowns on the Heads, this signifies he Beasts over that area. Of course he rules over the whole World. The Anti-Christ is the 7th Head of the 7 Headed Beast. Apollyon is the Scarlet Colored Beast. Red is Red, Scarlet is Purple. This entity as NO CROWNS unlike the Red Dragon of chapter 12. Rev. 17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. {NO CROWNS Mentioned at all here} 7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns. The Angel explains who the Woman Harlot is and who the Beast is. Remember, John is seeing this vision in 90ish AD. 8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. Perdition only means hes destined for hell. So the Beast has NO CROWNS, hes a Scarlet Colored Beast, not a Red Dragon, and he comes up from the Bottomless Pit. {See Rev. 9, Apollyon is released from the Bottomless Pit. Satan is never in the Pit until the 1000 year reign. No men come back to life. He was a Demon entity named Apollyon, placed over the Mediterranean Sea Region by Satan. God placed him in the Bottomless Pit, the gates of hell can not overcome the Church. We turned Rme from a Beast into a Conveyor belt of the Gospel, thus the Mortal Wound. Only after the Rapture will the Beast once again Conquer Israel and the Mediterranean Sea Region. The 7 Heads were Mountains {Powers} 5 gave fallen {ONE WAS = Rome} and one was NOT YET COME = The Anti-Christ. Satan is a POWER/Beast over this area also, as is Apollyon, but they are not Physical Kingdoms. There are only 7 earthly heads. Only the last Beast both ARISES and FALLS {is cast straight into hell}. They are not in one place, they are the 7 Kingdoms, Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia and Greece have fallen.....Rome was....the Anti-Christ is yet to come. The 8th is Apollyon, he will have been over all 7 by the time he is released from the Bottomless Pit. No man returns, the Fourth Beast {Europe} is reconstituted. It will look exactly the same on a map as the Old Roman Empire, we can see that by who all he Conquers in Da. 11:40-43. He Arises out of the Fourth Beasts {Dn. 7} Head....he is born in one of the Four {Dan. 8}Generals Kingdoms....ad he is a Assyrian {Isaiah 10}. All of these have to come true in order to fulfill all of these prophetic utterings. So he has to be born in Greece, because only Greece as per the Four Generals Kingdoms is in the E.U. and of course many Turks {Assyrian} live in Greece, they share a common border. That is why we get the DETAILED Chapter 11 history of the Grecian Wars. One Head is slain, but the Mortal Wound slays Rome, the Church is the Mortal Wound to the Beast. We overcame them via the Holy Spirit working through us, we are the Restrainer, once we are gone, the Beast can reconstitute. Gotta run, God bless, later. |
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Post by venge on Jun 24, 2019 19:06:23 GMT -6
Nope, you cannot trick me. Rev 17 states: 11And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition This 4rth beast that becomes the 8th is of the 7 previous heads. As all 5 heads were slain and it existed before Rome, when it comes back it becomes the 8th head. Rev 17:9-11 state the 7 heads are mountains, which are kingdoms, and the heads are also kings/leaders. 5 kings fell which are also 5 kingdoms and 5 heads. One kingdom is Rome, Rome’s leader and it is the 6th head. The 7th head comes after Rome which is a different kingdom and a king. The beast slain before Rome with its king does not exist when Rome ruled. This is the 8th head/kingdom/and king. The 4rth beast per Dan 7:23 is a kingdom ruled by a man. Not a Resurrected man. How many heads does a man have? Rev 13:3 3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: Not a man, a kingdom. 23Thus he said, The fourth beast shall be the fourth kingdom upon earth The false prophet causes all to worship the 4th beast which is the 8th head which is a kingdom. The kingdom that returns existed before Rome making it not Rome. Rev 17 is very specific. Do you not recall how once all 7 heads are slain the beast is dead yet the kingdoms live on holding the name of blasphemy without reigning? Yet one head resurrects and causes the beast to live with 6 dead heads. So this head that thought to be dead becomes the 8th. If 2 kingdoms/2 kings/which are 2 heads comes after Rome, it isn’t Rome. A Beast is one that Dominates thus its in Juxtaposition to Israel in every instance. Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia, Greece and Rome were all Kingdoms that Beasted over Israel in some manner or another. Satan assigns Demonic entities over specific areas, that is just fact......Ephesians 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places....... Satan is shown as a Red Dragon Beast in Rev. 12, with 7 Heads and 10 Horns with Crowns on the Heads, this signifies he Beasts over that area. Of course he rules over the whole World. The Anti-Christ is the 7th Head of the 7 Headed Beast. Apollyon is the Scarlet Colored Beast. Red is Red, Scarlet is Purple. This entity as NO CROWNS unlike the Red Dragon of chapter 12. Rev. 17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. {NO CROWNS Mentioned at all here} 7 And the angel said unto me, Wherefore didst thou marvel? I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns. The Angel explains who the Woman Harlot is and who the Beast is. Remember, John is seeing this vision in 90ish AD. 8 The beast that thou sawest was, and is not; and shall ascend out of the bottomless pit, and go into perdition: and they that dwell on the earth shall wonder, whose names were not written in the book of life from the foundation of the world, when they behold the beast that was, and is not, and yet is. Perdition only means hes destined for hell. So the Beast has NO CROWNS, hes a Scarlet Colored Beast, not a Red Dragon, and he comes up from the Bottomless Pit. {See Rev. 9, Apollyon is released from the Bottomless Pit. Satan is never in the Pit until the 1000 year reign. No men come back to life. He was a Demon entity named Apollyon, placed over the Mediterranean Sea Region by Satan. God placed him in the Bottomless Pit, the gates of hell can not overcome the Church. We turned Rme from a Beast into a Conveyor belt of the Gospel, thus the Mortal Wound. Only after the Rapture will the Beast once again Conquer Israel and the Mediterranean Sea Region. The 7 Heads were Mountains {Powers} 5 gave fallen {ONE WAS = Rome} and one was NOT YET COME = The Anti-Christ. Satan is a POWER/Beast over this area also, as is Apollyon, but they are not Physical Kingdoms. There are only 7 earthly heads. Only the last Beast both ARISES and FALLS {is cast straight into hell}. They are not in one place, they are the 7 Kingdoms, Egypt, Assyria, Babylon, Persia and Greece have fallen.....Rome was....the Anti-Christ is yet to come. The 8th is Apollyon, he will have been over all 7 by the time he is released from the Bottomless Pit. No man returns, the Fourth Beast {Europe} is reconstituted. It will look exactly the same on a map as the Old Roman Empire, we can see that by who all he Conquers in Da. 11:40-43. He Arises out of the Fourth Beasts {Dn. 7} Head....he is born in one of the Four {Dan. 8}Generals Kingdoms....ad he is a Assyrian {Isaiah 10}. All of these have to come true in order to fulfill all of these prophetic utterings. So he has to be born in Greece, because only Greece as per the Four Generals Kingdoms is in the E.U. and of course many Turks {Assyrian} live in Greece, they share a common border. That is why we get the DETAILED Chapter 11 history of the Grecian Wars. One Head is slain, but the Mortal Wound slays Rome, the Church is the Mortal Wound to the Beast. We overcame them via the Holy Spirit working through us, we are the Restrainer, once we are gone, the Beast can reconstitute. Gotta run, God bless, later. I have a problem following views contrary to scripture. |
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Post by boraddict on Jun 24, 2019 19:41:21 GMT -6
DS no one is going to trick you because you are too well grounded for that.
However, I did find some of what Rondon said, interesting.
So here is a tidbit off topic that I was thinking about yesterday. Let's say there are three heavens and the first began with Adam, the second with Christ, and the third upon Christ's return. So the first with man condemned to death, the second with man redeemed in Christ, and the third with Christ upon the earth with man. I have not had the time to work out the details but each of the three heavens would perhaps include a 70 week application of some sort as well as other applications that have taken place in the first two heavens.
So I am using heaven as heaven on earth with God the Father wanting to participate with a free and independent man. However, the first attempt failed with the fall of man. The second attempt failed when man killed the Savior. Now the third attempt will succeed and God will dwell with man. Thus there are three heavens on earth.
Consequently, the 70 weeks should occur three times.
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