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Post by mike on Feb 11, 2018 13:04:24 GMT -6
Mark 12:28-31
Which commandment is the most important of all?” 29 Jesus answered, “The most important is, ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one. 30 And you shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’ 31 The second is this: ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’ There is no other commandment greater than these.”
If I take only the gospels I don't see Jesus as the third commandment about Ego Jerry. While I don't disagree that ego would be encompassed in both commands, it doesn't need to be added.
I'd like to ask you take on the Epistles of John, Peter, James & Jude since they had first hand knowledge and with with Him? Your discrediting Paul should also discredit Luke & Marks gospels as they were not an original 12 apostle, similar to Paul.
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jerryh
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Post by jerryh on Feb 11, 2018 18:40:44 GMT -6
I don't discount even Paul. He said a lot of true things as the other writers. I don't see these men as infallible or the assertion that every word written is infallible. What I can see with my own eyes is those words being used as weapons to oppress and compel obedience. The Bible has become this living breathing thing to be worshipped or be branded and shunned if you don't. You know you use against each other all the time. I have to say that the church is every bit as guilty as Israel and have gone and created a golden calf.
I love much of the Bible because it affirms me. I'll quote particularly the parables. For myself, what's contained just there in those red letters and the stories around them, are enough to lead me into a very rich relationship with the Father. The journey of allowing Him to teach you in his own way is precious and one to be savored. Consider the lillies.. that's all you ever really needed if you are loving God with all your heart. But I digress..
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Post by Natalie on Feb 11, 2018 18:52:58 GMT -6
What makes a relationship with the Father possible?
The Bible is the Word of God. It's how God communicates His love, His will, His wisdom. We don't worship it; we worship its author.
And the Bible should convict you, not affirm you.
Hebrews 4:12 For the word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.
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jerryh
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Post by jerryh on Feb 11, 2018 20:18:05 GMT -6
Even with the word, as you know you can't hear unless you have those ears. He's talking about how we hear and his whole thing was teaching us how to do that. So he taught in parables that by their nature draw you into a pondering meditation. You know how these parables can take on different meanings as it speaks to our heart. The joy is in discovery and this child like faith in me has learned through this practice to be listening constantly and learning from all kinds of places. Including here. The simple truth is all we need but let's face it. Explaining beliefs like eternal torment are complicated. Even now, you probably immediately go to your bullet points. It wasn't meant to be so complicated. There are sweet hearted Peruvian tribes loving their version of the Father taught by spirits you can't perceive because you don't have their ears.
That was the problem with the Beast. My way or the highway. No they aren't saved yet but neither are you and it wasn't our job to save them anyway. That part of the Bible I consider a probable edit, among many.
Do you see? When He returns it will all make sense but it wasn't our job to take dominion over everyone else.
The Word still holds the deepest truths and it's to be cherished for sure. But be careful with that sword because the way you yourself yield it will directly affect you later. Pastors and Priests specially... they know the power of guilt very well and many use it fully even if they have the best intentions. I can tell you that a lot will be looking for that rock or cave to hide in. Because the sword coming out of His lips will utterly lay them in shame.
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Post by Natalie on Feb 11, 2018 20:31:04 GMT -6
What do you make of Jesus's words, "I am the way, the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father but through Me."
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Post by yardstick on Feb 11, 2018 21:15:18 GMT -6
jerryh It sounds like you're talking about legalism. And that some people use it to control others. Is that right? And if I am understanding you correctly, are you suggesting that all christians are doing that, or are you suggesting that only some are? How do you balance the use of well established doctrine as a means to ensure order in a venue, such as these boards; that have a clearly defined set of rules to follow (and with persons placed in authority to ensure the rules are followed) with the 'liberty' of not placing a 'stumbling block' before other believers?
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jerryh
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Post by jerryh on Feb 11, 2018 22:10:50 GMT -6
It's true Jesus is the only way but are you sure you know how or even when the saving part is? When exactly did or do you receive salvation? Jesus himself said he would go and then return, and then take us into that mansion. Period.
Now how did it get from that to its now done already and you need to do what?
I'm not attacking your faith in Jesus. I'm quoting him to attack Paul. Can you see how quickly you whip out that sword but can you just chill a bit here.
This Beast of a religion that causes this can't go into the next age. I'm sorry to break it to you but God is more loving than that. The only thing that will keep you from Him is your ego but it's a tough one to tame. Try to just focus on Jesus. When He said if your eye is single, what he meant was if your perspective is correct, then the whole body is full of light. We'll get into arguments all day over this so is bringing it down a notch really rocking your faith?
I do honestly forget we aren't on the same spiritual plain. Mine is very deep and has been a long time. I don't have to wonder like you because I've seen and known a side of the Father you couldn't. It's not that I think I'm any better at all. He's revealed an affectionate intimate side where even He submits to me. I don't have any confusion at all. Everything is rapidly making sense. I'm trying to illuminate but the eggshells I have to avoid .. I don't have any agenda. Maybe fill in some more of your questions from my perspective. If you find me too insulting of course I understand. There is a bigger picture but you really can't hear sometimes and I won't force feed.
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Post by grandpaskitzo on Feb 11, 2018 22:57:07 GMT -6
Proverbs 13:10 KJVS
[10] Only by pride cometh contention: but with the well advised is wisdom.
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Post by mike on Feb 12, 2018 7:11:30 GMT -6
It's true Jesus is the only way but are you sure you know how or even when the saving part is? When exactly did or do you receive salvation? Jesus himself said he would go and then return, and then take us into that mansion. Period. Now how did it get from that to its now done already and you need to do what? I'm not attacking your faith in Jesus. I'm quoting him to attack Paul. Can you see how quickly you whip out that sword but can you just chill a bit here. This Beast of a religion that causes this can't go into the next age. I'm sorry to break it to you but God is more loving than that. The only thing that will keep you from Him is your ego but it's a tough one to tame. Try to just focus on Jesus. When He said if your eye is single, what he meant was if your perspective is correct, then the whole body is full of light. We'll get into arguments all day over this so is bringing it down a notch really rocking your faith? I do honestly forget we aren't on the same spiritual plain. Mine is very deep and has been a long time. I don't have to wonder like you because I've seen and known a side of the Father you couldn't. It's not that I think I'm any better at all. He's revealed an affectionate intimate side where even He submits to me. I don't have any confusion at all. Everything is rapidly making sense. I'm trying to illuminate but the eggshells I have to avoid .. I don't have any agenda. Maybe fill in some more of your questions from my perspective. If you find me too insulting of course I understand. There is a bigger picture but you really can't hear sometimes and I won't force feed. You have made many definitive statements here yet you really know none of the people you speak with. How can you determine these things jerryh? Youve come to an on-line forum saying you're "not attacking anyones faith" & you "dont think youre any better" and in nearly the same breath say "we arent on the same spiritual plain" & "you cant really hear sometimes". And the kicker here jerry is that God submits to you? The creator of the universe submits to his creation? where do you get this from? Did Jesus say this to you directly or do we find that in the gospels? assuming you are not Jesus here means you are equal to me, the guy that cut me off this morning, Natalie and the next guy. We all breathe air, drink water, put on shoes the same way. That would mean God would submit himself to me, yardstick, grandpaskitzo, my neighbor, the homeless guy on the corner and so on. Yet from what I read here he's so affectionate and intimate with you that he submits to you. What is it that he was in submission to you for? Tell me what did you have him do for you? |
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Post by kjs on Feb 12, 2018 9:24:08 GMT -6
Ugh Paul was that Dragon that sidetracked Christianity in the first place. He was the false apostle Jesus warned about. He started by causing riots and divisions in the church. He's quoted by the worst of religious leaders to oppress and compel by force submission to the gospel of extortion. No you go look up what Jesus said to Peter with that sword. You don't know what spirit you are even talking from. So why should I consider Paul the final authority? Or you? Why do I even need to get back to you. You have no authority but to quote that guy? And do you really think the church is spotless and ready? Just how deceived are you? Wow, some very heavy charges are being laid against Apostle Paul! How are we ever supposed to find out who is right? Maybe we should let the Bible Speak for itself …….. The Apostle Peter spoke of the Apostle Paul and he had high praise for him….
2 Peter 15 Think of our Lord’s patience as facilitating salvation, just as our dear brother Paul also wrote to you according to the wisdom given him. 16 He speaks about this subject in all his letters. Some things in them are hard to understand, which ignorant and unstable people distort, leading to their own destruction, as they do the rest of the Scriptures.According to the Apostle Peter, some of the writings of the Apostle Paul are hard to understand….. but the Apostle Peter does not dismiss these writings …. He calls them Paul’s wisdom. He also says that “ignorant and unstable people will try to distort” Paul’s teachings – yet these people do so and face destruction…… Sounds like Apostle Peter had a high regard for Apostle Paul --- maybe we should do the same…… |
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Post by thetimeoftheend on Feb 12, 2018 11:09:20 GMT -6
jerryh, God submits to you? "You have said in your heart 'I will ascend to the heavens, I will raise my throne above the stars of God...'" Isaiah 14:13 Yet you believe it is everyone else's ego who stands in the way of attaining your secret knowledge? God stretched out the heavens, the stars are the work of His hands - yet he submits to you? This is a doctrine of devils. We have heard this lie before from the enemy. "Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so also these teachers oppose truth." 2 Timothy 3:8
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jerryh
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Post by jerryh on Feb 12, 2018 18:10:58 GMT -6
I'm the guy who is unsealing your prophecy and letting the horses out. That sound you hear is love trying to wake you up. I didn't think you'd like it and yea it sure is bitter in your stomach but in the end I'm carrying a bigger Bible stick because it's your problem going into that lake. The watchmen will be judged a bit more harshly because they didn't recognize the signs and when they did, they kept silent.
Now how does that feel? The measure you wanted to heap on me will be heaped on you and I didn't even lift a finger. You do it to yourself.
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Post by Natalie on Feb 12, 2018 19:01:42 GMT -6
Jerry -- Jesus's death on the cross was enough. He said, "It is finished." And God raised Him from the dead to show that the sacrifice was acceptable. A person is saved at the moment they believe that Jesus took their punishment. They are made right with God at that moment- saved for ever more. We are now being sanctified through the Holy Spirit working in us. Jesus will soon call us Home where we will be with Him physically -- where we are presently positionaly with Him. No believer will be going into the lake of fire.
We would be glad to discuss things with you, but your attitude is breaking rule 3.
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jerryh
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Post by jerryh on Feb 12, 2018 23:48:35 GMT -6
No I'm well versed in what you believe. I went to a sorta bible school that was part of the Jesus movement in a commune mid 70's that became Calvary Chapel for many years. I did a YWAM DTS and was on the mission field in Asia 6 years playing music. My background was basically homeless teenager who had explosive spiritual experience and escaped from prison as a result. My stories I've shared to many tens of thousands because I was always the one to give the message. So I really do know. When I say I'm off the charts, it's my experience that people either don't believe me or think I'm psycho. For years I didn't get it because everyone says they have Jesus in their heart. But what that presence in the heart means to me is very dynamic on a different level. I' have no desire to impress anyone. I'm 62, work in a factory baking your Oreo cookies. I am not trying to lead peeps astray. But I can't ignore this truth whether you accept it or not. So allow me to love my Jesus as much as you do. It's not that I want to rob your faith. It's that I see a much different side. Not altogether different really. But in a nutshell, it comes down to when. I don't believe Jesus exactly said it the way Paul infers it. And that's where it became a different thing altogether. I'm not attacking anyone. I'm challenging and attempting to alter your perceptions of the Father. That's exactly what Jesus was doing. Like him, I also am forced to pull rank and say this is how He is with me. I freely admit that my relationship with the Father is on the very same level as Jesus. I know exactly how the Spirit works and like Jesus I know God as a literal Soirit that comes and goes in my life constantly like the wind. I have been documenting all this since my Pentecost sudden awakening almost 2 years ago. This is nothing new however. I knew him intimately for many years and my relationship with him was enough. I was a virgin when I married at 33 and for 28 years of marriage my relationship with the Father had become distant. My story since has been literally the Prodigal son. You won't like what you read but go ahead.. you'll then slowly back away. It happens every time. It's not my fault. I'm only a witness.
Yes I know. You will form your own opinions. Over this period, it was my wife who divorced me because of one day when for the first time ever, I was filled with the HS in the presence of someone else. When it happens, I weep for joy. She later told me that was the day she considered the marriage irrevocably broken. Turned out best for both of us because my relationship with the Father came roaring back. But I've lost all my savings, all my friends are shunning me for the same reasons you find me offensive. I am overwhelmed by His love that I've always known and my burning heart is to see his reputation restored. I firmly believe if you could see Him as I see him, you would for sure love him even more than you obviously do now.
I believe very differently than you. But His heart is in me and He dearly loves you too. That's why I'm bracing the headwinds here. It would really please Him if the Church woke up before he actually got here. My heart and His heart are that we all see ourselves as we really are and I believe seeing Jesus as he really is will help. He still resists the proud and the meek are still the ones that are going to inherit the earth. They may not be streets of gold but if you can believe me heaven may erupt inside you in joy.
But like I said. I've said enough here and if I'm breaking rules then it's fine. I think you can see my heart well enough and you can figure out the rest without my help. And I do mean that.
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Post by mike on Feb 13, 2018 6:47:11 GMT -6
Jerry, I am sorry to hear that you've seemingly lost everything. My suspicion is that me saying that means I dont understand and I'm ok with that. I wouldnt disagree that its all bad losing friends and even savings, I mean
Luke 21:16 And ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and [some] of you shall they cause to be put to death. 17 And ye shall be hated of all [men] for my name's sake.
But the one thing that strikes me the most in what you just said above is that you offend everyone and everyone seems to not understand. Everyone turns away from you, but you're okay with it. Who is then that you are reaching with your message about God?
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