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Post by disciple4life on Dec 28, 2017 5:03:04 GMT -6
Okay, I hope no one minds if I continue working on Dennis' thread. After all, I do agree with his 50 days although I think the count starts somewhere other than the chapter 12 sign. So in a way I am championing his cause. First, let us consider two verses that reference the "clouds" metaphor that means the enraptured church. Rev. 14:14, And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle.
Thus, the Lord is with the enraptured church, the "cloud." Let's look at what happens next: Isa. 19:1, The burden of Egypt. Behold, the LORD rideth upon a swift cloud, and shall come into Egypt: and the idols of Egypt shall be moved at his presence, and the heart of Egypt shall melt in the midst of it.Thus, when the rapture takes place then there is civil war in "Egypt." Who is Egypt?Two remarks: First may I ask a honest question? where do you see a connection between Rev 14:14 and Isa 19:1? Is it only by the word cloud or is there more? If so, what else? The golden rule of interpretation states: I think, and this is common sense within the bible teacher community, that Egypt here is the real Egypt. This scripture further hints that the pyramids may play a role as a sign (something, Daniel W. Matson has researched long ago here). A personal remark: I would never build doctrine from that, but I think it is worth a second thought (The connections of the Great Pyramid to the Messiah are mind-boggling templates). 100% Agreed Stephen, You just beat me to the questions. ;-) Along with this same thought - and same reasoning for the questions, plus a few extra. This is really to boraddict since you are making the points. One passage says 'white cloud', and the other passage says 'swift cloud'. - What is the basis for thinking/ saying that either of these clouds ( or any cloud passage in the Bible ) represents the raptured church? Can you post a link from a commentary? or perhaps another scripture that says this represents the church? - Why aren't any other / all other cloud passages related to these? - Is it just white clouds that represent the raptured church, or swift clouds or both? I don't speak for Stephen or anyone else really -but this is one of the many reasons people have raised lots of questions regarding the interpretation /eisegesis in this thread. You mention 50 days but 50 days from Sept 23 would be about Nov 12th. Depending on whether you use inclusive counting. 50 days before Dec 31 would be Nov 11th. Aside from the fact that there is no mention anywhere in scripture to count 12 days, or 30 days, or 50, or 70 or 99 from any date or event, to give us the rapture, - the foundation for the entire premise of this thread, was based on the assumption/ eisegesis that God has to reveal everything he does to prophets - and this includes telling us the date of the rapture in code, connected with combining purification time periods with a planetary alignment, which happened, but there is wide disagreement regarding what this alignment means, and there was no harpazo event. Where we are is tantamount to giving reasons from Strong's or Gematria to why Elvis is one of the two witnesses.
Longing for the coming of our Savior. ;-) Maranatha. Hope to see all my fellow watchmen very soon.
Disciple4life
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Post by Deleted on Dec 28, 2017 6:18:05 GMT -6
........ You mention 50 days but 50 days from Sept 23 would be about Nov 12th. Depending on whether you use inclusive counting. 50 days before Dec 31 would be Nov 11th. Aside from the fact that there is no mention anywhere in scripture to count 12 days, or 30 days, or 50, or 70 or 99 from any date or event, to give us the rapture, - the foundation for the entire premise of this thread, was based on the assumption/ eisegesis that God has to reveal everything he does to prophets - and this includes telling us the date of the rapture in code, connected with combining purification time periods with a planetary alignment, which happened, but there is wide disagreement regarding what this alignment means, and there was no harpazo event. Where we are is tantamount to giving reasons from Strong's or Gematria to why Elvis is one of the two witnesses. Longing for the coming of our Savior. ;-) Maranatha. Hope to see all my fellow watchmen very soon. Disciple4life I also agree with you D4L, I often come to this board and realize, you yet asked my questions and stated my opinions  May I chime in here and post my understanding of the ominous count, mentioned in this thread (and labeled in blue above) here? Here's the scripture again: As far as I understand dennislwatson , he restarted the count after the 7 weeks (=49 days) and thus added 50 more days, ending up with 99 days. It may be a possible interpretation of these 2 verses, I didn't interpret them that way. Maybe someone more skilled in grammar and language can add to this? |
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Post by boraddict on Dec 28, 2017 7:05:30 GMT -6
Two remarks: First may I ask a honest question? where do you see a connection between Rev 14:14 and Isa 19:1? Is it only by the word cloud or is there more? If so, what else? The golden rule of interpretation states: I think, and this is common sense within the bible teacher community, that Egypt here is the real Egypt. This scripture further hints that the pyramids may play a role as a sign (something, Daniel W. Matson has researched long ago here). A personal remark: I would never build doctrine from that, but I think it is worth a second thought (The connections of the Great Pyramid to the Messiah are mind-boggling templates). 100% Agreed Stephen, You just beat me to the questions. ;-) Along with this same thought - and same reasoning for the questions, plus a few extra. This is really to boraddict since you are making the points. One passage says 'white cloud', and the other passage says 'swift cloud'. - What is the basis for thinking/ saying that either of these clouds ( or any cloud passage in the Bible ) represents the raptured church? Can you post a link from a commentary? or perhaps another scripture that says this represents the church? - Why aren't any other / all other cloud passages related to these? - Is it just white clouds that represent the raptured church, or swift clouds or both? I don't speak for Stephen or anyone else really -but this is one of the many reasons people have raised lots of questions regarding the interpretation /eisegesis in this thread. You mention 50 days but 50 days from Sept 23 would be about Nov 12th. Depending on whether you use inclusive counting. 50 days before Dec 31 would be Nov 11th. Aside from the fact that there is no mention anywhere in scripture to count 12 days, or 30 days, or 50, or 70 or 99 from any date or event, to give us the rapture, - the foundation for the entire premise of this thread, was based on the assumption/ eisegesis that God has to reveal everything he does to prophets - and this includes telling us the date of the rapture in code, connected with combining purification time periods with a planetary alignment, which happened, but there is wide disagreement regarding what this alignment means, and there was no harpazo event. Where we are is tantamount to giving reasons from Strong's or Gematria to why Elvis is one of the two witnesses.
Longing for the coming of our Savior. ;-) Maranatha. Hope to see all my fellow watchmen very soon.
Disciple4life
Thank you Stephen and D4L. I have not addressed the 50 days in detail; however, I will attempt to prove that it is our Passover time period. First I am trying to show that Egypt in scripture is the U. S. Yes there are literal references to Egypt like in the story of Moses leading the children of Israel from Egypt and so forth. Nevertheless, it is my understanding that in the prophets, "Egypt" is a metaphor. To show this I am using the clouds metaphor. The "clouds" metaphor was discussed here unsealed.boards.net/post/15857/thread, and at that time I did a quick analysis of Rev. 1:7 with an application pertaining to the great multitude of Rev. 7:9 and 19:6 that is the church in its marriage to Lord Jesus. Although at that time I said the 144,000. Perhaps I should have started the conversation with the great multitude. Do you agree that the "great multitude" is the church in its marriage to Lord Jesus? As a general rule metaphors stay fairly consistent in their application. There are some exceptions that seem to be caused from the context of the verses. However, the white clouds of Rev. 14:14 representing something clean, and the swift clouds of Isa. 19:1 representing something fast does not show a discrepancy in the overall meaning of the metaphor. That is, the rapture is both clean and fast; thus, the clouds metaphor representing the rapture fits into both of these verses. As far as the other numbers you mentioned (12, 30, 70, 99, etc.), I concede the argument and agree with you there. So we are speaking of the 50 days of the Passover and this begins with an investigation of the metaphor "great multitude." With regard to Daniel W. Matson, have not read the link yet but am of the opinion that scripture has many unfolding truths (silentknight). With regard to other connections between Rev. 14:14 and Isa. 19:1. Isaiah Chapters 17, 18, and 19 are in chronological order. The fall of Damascus is at hand so we are currently in the period of time of Isaiah Chapter 17. Next we will pass through Isaiah Chapter 18 that contains fall of Babylon that corresponds to Rev. 18:2 and we end up at Isa. Chapter 19 that corresponds to Rev. 18:4 and the remainder of that chapter. |
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Post by Natalie on Dec 28, 2017 7:38:23 GMT -6
May I chime in here and post my understanding of the ominous count, mentioned in this thread (and labeled in blue above) here? Here's the scripture again: As far as I understand dennislwatson , he restarted the count after the 7 weeks (=49 days) and thus added 50 more days, ending up with 99 days. It may be a possible interpretation of these 2 verses, I didn't interpret them that way. Maybe someone more skilled in grammar and language can add to this? There is another thread that is discussing how it should be interpreted. I'm not sure if there has been a satisfactory conclusion. unsealed.boards.net/thread/1258/pentecost-counted-sabbaths-plus-days |
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Post by boraddict on Dec 28, 2017 8:42:48 GMT -6
Thank you Natalie. I had not realized this other thread existed. I am going to watch things a little closer now.
Leviticus 23:15-16
15 And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath, from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering; seven sabbaths shall be complete:
16 Even unto the morrow after the seventh sabbath shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering unto the Lord.
I can see the error. There is a count pertaining to the wave offering which is the feast of weeks. There are seven weeks ending on day 49. The day after is day 50.
Thus, "And ye shall count unto you from the morrow after the sabbath (day 50), from the day that ye brought the sheaf of the wave offering (day 49); seven sabbaths shall be complete." Thus, from the end of the wave offering (day 49) seven Sabbaths being complete, then the next day is day 50. This is the day of rapture.
Again, "Even unto the morrow (day 50) after the seventh sabbath (day 49) shall ye number fifty days; and ye shall offer a new meat offering (the rapture) unto the Lord.
"
There has never been a day 99. It is only 49 days that are the feast of weeks that is the Passover, and the next day is the rapture; day 50.
It is this Passover that I hope to prove.
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Post by krnboitae on Jan 1, 2018 5:44:36 GMT -6
Hi guys! I was wrong about this. I have no excuse. I apologize to you. Today, I still thanked, praised, apologized to God. I will continue to love God no matter what. This is a humbling experience for me. God knows true intention of my heart. I let you all down! But I did not do that to deceive you or lie to you. I was very disappointed too. I was wrong but through this experience, I got more closer to God. I hope to get to know God more. It is still high watch period and I will continue to watch but never set a date again. I am so sorry! I will take all the criticism. Thank you. Please forgive me! I will take some time off here. See you all soon in the heaven! Read more: unsealed.boards.net/thread/1201/rev12-virgo-sign-warning-rapture?page=6#ixzz52vs37TDw |
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Post by disciple4life on Jan 1, 2018 8:17:40 GMT -6
Hello My Brother,
We love you, I want you to be encouraged that you didn't let us down. ;-) Nothing has changed about our Lord, or this community really. We are still watching, and still praying and searching God's word, and continue on the journey.
I appreciate your humility and the apology is accepted. I
I stand with you 100% and believe that this is a high watch time. This is still the 70th Year, from Israel becoming a nation - and the fact remains that Revelation 12 sign happened, and it means something, and for sure - 100%, we saw prophecy become fulfilled with the alliance between Turkey, Iran and Russia, and even Jewish rabbis and leaders say that the official declaration of Jerusalem as the real, historic and official capital of Israel is paving the way - setting the stage for the 3rd Temple.
Keep Looking up, krnboitae, and all my dear brothers and sisters - Maranatha. Our hope is not in a sign, a date, a king or a conjunction, - our trust and hope is in Christ and his promise to return. ;-)
Disciple4life. |
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Post by davewatchman on Jan 1, 2018 9:03:23 GMT -6
Don't worry Teddy, December 31 might have been something. I still think we're in the zone. We are in the time slot for this thing to happen. I'm convinced that there's a designated area for this to take place, but there's also some unknowable variables no man can know. The time slot may depend on an exact mirror image of the "days of Noah". But if those days had not been shortened, no flesh could be saved alive. One of the ways where I'm different than you guys here is that I would never want what I think is the evidence to fall into the wrong hands. In other words, I would hesitate to publish the data on fivedoves or any other public forum on the net. On the other hand, if this were a private group only seen by the members of this forum, it might be different. I would tell individuals in person. I'm just more stingy about passing out what I think might be the pearls. Somewhere near the end of: "for then there will be great tribulation", four angels have been prepared for the very hour and day and month and year to kill a third of mankind. If that hour begins on a day when too few a number of mankind exist because of the early tribulation events, no flesh would be saved alive to see the "darkened" sun and a moon that will not give her light. The "hour and day and month and year" sounds like a punctiliar pinpoint in time that can't be moved around, so those "days" must have to be "cut short" on the front end? Is this one of the reasons that our Master is delayed? Next weekend is the Epiphany conjunction between Jupiter and Mars. And this takes place in the constellation of the scales of Libra. This can also be understood as the alter of God.  The Witness of the Stars
E. W. Bullinger
The First Book
The Redeemer
(His First Coming)
"The sufferings of Christ"
Chapter II
The Sign Libra
"In the more ancient Akkadian the months were called after the names of the signs, and the sign of the seventh month is the sign that we now call Libra. The Akkadian name for it was Tulku. Tul means mound (like dhul and dul), and ku means sacred; hence, Tulku means the sacred mound, or the holy altar.
The sacred mound, the holy alter. "but her child was caught up to God and to his throne
The Epiphany conjunction also counts out the 365 days of Noah in this study: creation.com/images/pdfs/tj/j22_1/j22_1_62-64.pdfAnd that runs right into the "darkened' sun. This video talks about the Epiphany conjunction, but you might want to speed it up to about the 28 minute mark if interested. It's a long one. |
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Post by boraddict on Jan 1, 2018 9:49:59 GMT -6
Dave said "The time slot may depend on an exact mirror image of the "days of Noah". But if those days had not been shortened, no flesh could be saved alive."
I think you are on to something.
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Post by mike on Jan 1, 2018 13:42:10 GMT -6
krnboitae thank you for your humility and acknowledgment. No one here was trying to prove you 'wrong' rather trying to help you discern that 12/31 may not have been accurate based on the reasons you (and Dennis) provided. No "I told you so"...no one here is perfect, in fact quite far from it. We serve a wonderful master who we continue to wait for and watch for. Please continue to watch and share nuggets as you come across them.
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Post by krnboitae on Jan 1, 2018 14:47:17 GMT -6
krnboitae thank you for your humility and acknowledgment. No one here was trying to prove you 'wrong' rather trying to help you discern that 12/31 may not have been accurate based on the reasons you (and Dennis) provided. No "I told you so"...no one here is perfect, in fact quite far from it. We serve a wonderful master who we continue to wait for and watch for. Please continue to watch and share nuggets as you come across them. Thank you all. Mr. Watson feels really bad about it too. Please forgive him also. He doesnt know that he is able to post on the board now. |
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Post by boraddict on Jan 1, 2018 15:09:04 GMT -6
Every once in a while someone says something that makes me laugh. Okay, I have an odd since of humor; perhaps. Nevertheless, for anyone to think they are not welcome on this board is hilarious. As a matter of fact, if Mr. Watson does not reappear soon I will be deeply hurt. Please krnboitae, share that with Mr. Watson. This is his thread, not mine. How much longer can I keep this up. I should be hanging out on silent's thread by now.  He told me I could do that. |
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Post by mike on Jan 1, 2018 15:21:32 GMT -6
Yes krnboitae...Mr Watson was put in time out until 1/1 😅 He is welcome back here, without judgement or consequence. Plz tell him to bring 2.0 |
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Post by krnboitae on Jan 1, 2018 15:29:58 GMT -6
Every once in a while someone says something that makes me laugh. Okay, I have an odd since of humor; perhaps. Nevertheless, for anyone to think they are not welcome on this board is hilarious. As a matter of fact, if Mr. Watson does not reappear soon I will be deeply hurt. Please krnboitae, share that with Mr. Watson. This is his thread, not mine. How much longer can I keep this up. I should be hanging out on silent's thread by now. He told me I could do that. I told him he can post now~! |
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Post by Deleted on Jan 2, 2018 8:27:21 GMT -6
krnboitae , I don't believe it is necessary for you to apologize for setting a wrong date. We all are here for you, not to condemn you, but to envelop you in our loving arms of Christ. However, I do think there is an opportunity for the body to learn here, and I think, perhaps in your apology post, you did not demonstrate a learning of the correct lessons. Your response was remorse and sorrow, I don’t doubt that. And prior to 12/31 you carried a great attitude as you discussed your ideas. But in your apology note you stated: 1. you would never set a date again 2. you were going to take time away from the site 3. you were going to get closer to God I believe those are exactly the wrong lessons to learn from this experience. If it was only you learning this lesson, I may have just let it slip so as not to cause you any more anguish. But there are many people who have watched this experience play out and I feel we could all benefit from viewing this situation from a different angle. So, please bare with me as I use your experience as a learning opportunity. - - - The mistake was not in stating to this body what you believed God was telling you. The mistake was not even saying that you were prophesying in the name of God. Most people likely see those two things as the mistake that was made. And based on your apology, you seem to think it was a mistake to provide the date that God told you. Neither of these were mistakes! As a matter of fact, if you truly believed that God was speaking this to you and that you were to tell the body and then didn’t tell the body - that would have been sin. Do not concern yourself with those would would talk about false prophets. That does not relate in this context. Teddy, You spoke in love and you told the body what you believed God was telling you. THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT YOU SHOULD HAVE DONE! What else could you do? But then it turned out that one of three scenarios happened: 1. You didn’t hear God at all 2. You heard God but did not interpret His Word correctly 3. God told you the wrong date The correct way to respond now, is not to make a promise never to declare another date. What if God gives you another date and tells you to tell the body? Would you disobey God? Would you break your promise? Now you would need to do one or the other and they are both sin. I would suggest you correct this action by informing the body that you might speak another date, if led by the Lord to do so. The correct way to respond now, is not to separate yourself from the very body that can benefit you and that could benefit by watching you grow through this experience. I suggest that you do not take some time away from unsealed, but rather engage even more. So, what is the proper response to what happened, both from the you and from the body? Well, I believe it is threefold. 1. Teddy: Determine which of the three scenarios took place. 2. Teddy: Submit and Describe your learning experience to the body. 3. Body: Walk with Teddy as he endures this humbling experience, but don’t simply forgive and move on. I won’t, in this post, dive into a big expose on hearing God. But I strongly encourage all of you to read the thread we put together on this topic. You can find it here. And Teddy, you, in particular could benefit from the thread, if only to provide some clarity on what you might have experienced. We, as Christians, are walking a walk of faith and so it is necessary for us to learn from each event. The learning is done via fire, but not like you might be thinking. Most of us are willing to learn by fire, but the way we think it works is that we do something, we get burned, and so we don’t do that again - we avoid the fire. But my friends, that is not the way God’s fire works - that is mans fire. God’s fire works like this - we do something, we get burned, and we do it again - only better the next time as we submit ourselves to the fire. In this case, God is burning Teddy, and if Teddy runs from us or promises not to set another date, he is not allowing the fire to burn off the idols in his heart. We all have the idols Teddy, this is not something personal about you. As Teddy allows himself to be burned through humble submission to the Father, He walks his Pentecost walk before the Lord and before this body. He identifies his idols and ask the Father to burn them away. This will be an ongoing experience for the rest of his, and our, lives. His ability to properly hear and discern God’s voice will grow. As a body, our job is to grow along with Teddy. We can learn how to love, how to judge, and how to properly discern God’s voice ourselves. Did we agree with Teddy? Did we wonder? Or did we know this was not the correct discernment? Each of us can do the same thing Teddy does. Allow God to burn off our own idols that caused us to agree or wonder about his date. By Teddy doing this visibly, we all can do it in private - or perhaps even share with the body to come alongside Teddy. It is too easy to just forgive and move on. But that is mercy without justice. Some believe we are not called to judge - this is not true. We are called to judge as the Father give us the proper judgment. And we are in training to judge. We are not called to condemn. We are not called to judge without first hearing the Father. But we are also not called to forgive and ignore. We must deal with situations when they arise as our Father leads us. Prior to 12/31, I praised both Teddy and Dennis for following the voice of God as they thought they heard Him. I still have the same praise today. There was a significant difference in the level of love that each exhibited, and that needs to be addressed - and has been. Another note: Many in the body will use this as an example of how God does not speak to people or how we should be very careful to the point of almost ignoring others when they claim to hear God. That is an over simplification of what takes place and is usually spoken by those who do not know how to hear the voice of God. Instead, we should all learn from this about our own idols and practice hearing God in our lives. God is not building a body that depends on priests and pastors and preachers - He is building a kingdom of Priests! We must all learn to hear God. The task now, is to learn from these events. I suggest a good starting place would be the Hearing God thread.
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He told me I could do that.