dent
Layman
Posts: 61
|
Post by dent on May 26, 2018 19:51:09 GMT -6
I got to the point a few years ago.
To "Miss the Point" is to Sin (by definition of the Greek, NOT the English which is Miss translation).
Have a great night's sleep and thanks for being such a terrific host.
Really!
Dent
|
|
|
|
Post by yardstick on May 26, 2018 19:56:21 GMT -6
Dent, thank you for joining the board. I have read the thread to this point and have an observation, and a request>
My observation is that you have made a great many assertions; however, I am not seeing much scriptural basis for them.
Would you be so kind as to explain your logical progression (step-by-step, with as tiny a step as possible, if necessary) to one of your conclusions, please?
How about from your original post:
Can you please explain what the tree of life is that will be 'revealed' for the first time, since Adam and Eve lost sight of it?
Should we be assuming that you are referring in your statement to the well known passage of scripture where Adam and Even were removed from the Eden (Genesis 3:23)?
Which version of the Bible are you using?
Can you please explain how you know it will be the end of June? (What source(s) are you using to draw your conclusion from?)
Thank you in advance for your on-point respons(es).
|
|
|
|
Post by boraddict on May 26, 2018 19:59:42 GMT -6
Hi Dent, I find it interesting that you have used the words "I AM" now a second time in reference to yourself. Additionally, please show the verse to which you are referring in which Jesus said " I AM a Truthful man." I have already shown that your previous claim (that John was not the author of the Book of Revelation) is false. How then can you be a truthful man? To what were you commissioned and by whom? Here's the reference emboldened:- 32 You’ll know the truth, and the truth will make you free.” 33 They answered, “We’re Abraham’s descendants and have never been enslaved to anyone. How do you say, ‘You’ll become free’?” 34 Jesus answered, “Everyone who misses the point (sins) is slave to missing the point (sin). 35 The slave doesn’t remain in the house forever; the Son does. 36 If the Son makes you free, you’ll indeed be free. 37 You’re Abraham’s descendants yet you seek to kill me because my word has no place in you. 38 I speak things I’ve seen with Father. You do things you heard from your father.” 39 They answered, “Abraham’s our father.” Jesus said, “If you’re Abraham’s children, do his deeds. 40 As it is you’re seeking to kill me: a Truthful man. Abraham didn’t do that. 41 You’re doing the deeds of your father.” They said, “We’re not bastards; our father’s God.” 42 Jesus said, “If God were your Father, you’d love me for I’ve come from God. 43 Why don’t you understand what I’m saying? Are you deaf? John 8. Dent Thank you Dent. Here is the King James: "But now ye seek to kill me, a man that hath told you the truth, which I have heard of God: this did not Abraham" (John 8:40). I pulled this quote from a bible website. In both verses, yours and mine, we do not find the quote that you referenced above ("I AM a Truthful man"). However, it could be paraphrased as you have stated it. By the way, what Bible are you using? |
|
dent
Layman
Posts: 61
|
Post by dent on May 26, 2018 20:09:40 GMT -6
What's the difference between his (admittedly accurate) quote referring to himself as "a Truthful man" and me transposing his words to the first person singular from my third party perspective "I am a Truthful man"?
Same deal in John 4 where he actually said "I am the one you referenced" and transposing that as "I am Messiah" because "Messiah" was who the woman referenced?
I don't see the problem?
Dent
|
|
|
|
Post by boraddict on May 26, 2018 23:24:48 GMT -6
What's the difference between his (admittedly accurate) quote referring to himself as "a Truthful man" and me transposing his words to the first person singular from my third party perspective "I am a Truthful man"? Same deal in John 4 where he actually said "I am the one you referenced" and transposing that as "I am Messiah" because "Messiah" was who the woman referenced? I don't see the problem? Dent Hi Dent, Unless I can see the quote in scripture then it is not "admittedly accurate." What bible are you using? Secondly, you have changed your paraphrased quote from "I AM a Truthful man" to "I am a Truthful man." Please do not insult my intelligence. Anyone can see the difference and I do not understand your games but they are just that. Clearly you do not take scripture seriously so please stop. |
|
dent
Layman
Posts: 61
|
Post by dent on May 26, 2018 23:55:08 GMT -6
Please boradict,
Since you are so very "serious".
Would you please explain the difference in meaning between say "god" and "God" and say "I am", "i am" and "I AM"?
Bearing in mind that neither the Hebrew nor Greek of our original Scriptures contained capitalization (which didn't appear in Greek until around 300ad). Long after they were set by their respective authors.
One reason was that in Biblical days, the method of communicating Scripture was by public reading in which capitalization cannot be "pronounced". And until relatively recent times (the past 500 years) the vast majority of common folk couldn't read anyway. And when they could, the clerics insisted in using Ancient languages. For example Catholics were obliged to hear "The Word" in Latin (throughout the whole World) until Vatican 2 in 1964 (when I was 6 and attending Catholic school at the time).
Additionally, when the Bible was translated into English, the translators were persecuted in England and moved to the continent from whence they smuggled loose pages (within other books) for subsequent binding in England. The KJV was King James antidote (because he faced popular revolt). His view was that placing Bibles that people could actually read into the domain of ordinary folk was "dangerous".
So please tell me the game you think I'm playing?
Dent
|
|
|
|
Post by boraddict on May 27, 2018 1:18:30 GMT -6
Please boradict, Since you are so very "serious". Would you please explain the difference in meaning between say "god" and "God" and say "I am", "i am" and "I AM"? Bearing in mind that neither the Hebrew nor Greek of our original Scriptures contained capitalization (which didn't appear in Greek until around 300ad). Long after they were set by their respective authors. One reason was that in Biblical days, the method of communicating Scripture was by public reading in which capitalization cannot be "pronounced". And until relatively recent times (the past 500 years) the vast majority of common folk couldn't read anyway. And when they could, the clerics insisted in using Ancient languages. For example Catholics were obliged to hear "The Word" in Latin (throughout the whole World) until Vatican 2 in 1964 (when I was 6 and attending Catholic school at the time). Additionally, when the Bible was translated into English, the translators were persecuted in England and moved to the continent from whence they smuggled loose pages (within other books) for subsequent binding in England. The KJV was King James antidote (because he faced popular revolt). His view was that placing Bibles that people could actually read into the domain of ordinary folk was "dangerous". So please tell me the game you think I'm playing? Dent Hi Dent, To begin with, I asked you to "please" provide scriptural references and you provide "John 4 where he actually said "I am the one you referenced" and transposing that as "I am Messiah" because "Messiah" was who the woman referenced." What kind of reference is this. John 4, like a whole chapter and you list it as "I am the one you referenced" and that is supposedly transposed as "I am Messiah." Really? Okay, so I will bring John 4 from a website as follows: 1 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John, 2 (Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,) 3 He left Judaea, and departed again into Galilee. 4 And he must needs go through Samaria. 5 Then cometh he to a city of Samaria, which is called Sychar, near to the parcel of ground that Jacob gave to his son Joseph. 6 Now Jacob's well was there. Jesus therefore, being wearied with his journey, sat thus on the well: and it was about the sixth hour. 7 There cometh a woman of Samaria to draw water: Jesus saith unto her,Give me to drink. 8 (For his disciples were gone away unto the city to buy meat.) 9 Then saith the woman of Samaria unto him, How is it that thou, being a Jew, askest drink of me, which am a woman of Samaria? for the Jews have no dealings with the Samaritans. 10 Jesus answered and said unto her,If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water. 11 The woman saith unto him, Sir, thou hast nothing to draw with, and the well is deep: from whence then hast thou that living water? 12 Art thou greater than our father Jacob, which gave us the well, and drank thereof* himself, and his children, and his cattle? 13 Jesus answered and said unto her,Whosoever drinketh of this water shall thirst again: 14 But whosoever* drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never** thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life. 15 The woman saith unto him, Sir, give me this water, that I thirst not, neither come hither to draw. 16 Jesus saith unto her,Go, call thy husband, and come hither. 17 The woman answered and said, I have no husband. Jesus said unto her, Thou hast well said*,I have no husband: 18 For thou hast had five husbands; and he whom thou now hast is not thy husband: in that saidst thou truly. 19 The woman saith unto him, Sir, I perceive that thou art a prophet. 20 Our fathers worshipped in this mountain; and ye say, that in Jerusalem is the place where men ought to worship. 21 Jesus saith unto her,Woman, believe me, the hour cometh*, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. 23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth. 25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things. 26 Jesus saith unto her,I that speak unto thee am he. 27 And upon this came his disciples, and marvelled that he talked with the woman: yet no man said, What seekest thou? or, Why talkest thou with her? 28 The woman then left her waterpot, and went her way into the city, and saith to the men, 29 Come, see a man, which told me all things that ever I did: is not this the Christ? 30 Then they went out of the city, and came unto him. 31 In the mean while his disciples prayed him, saying, Master, eat. 32 But he said unto them,I have meat to eat that ye know not of. 33 Therefore said the disciples one to another*, Hath any man brought him ought to eat? 34 Jesus saith unto them,My meat is to do the will of him that sent me, and to finish his work. 35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest. 36 And he that reapeth receiveth wages, and gathereth fruit unto life eternal: that both he that soweth and he that reapeth may rejoice together. 37 And herein* is that saying true*, One soweth*, and another reapeth. 38 I sent you to reap that whereon ye bestowed no labour: other men laboured, and ye are entered into their labours. 39 And many of the Samaritans of that city believed on him for the saying of the woman, which testified*, He told me all that ever I did. 40 So when the Samaritans were come unto him, they besought him that he would tarry with them: and he abode there two days. 41 And many more believed because of his own word; 42 And said unto the woman*, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world. 43 Now after two days he departed* thence, and went into Galilee. 44 For Jesus himself testified, that a prophet hath no honour in his own country. 45 Then when he was come into Galilee, the Galilaeans received him, having seen all the things that he did at Jerusalem at the feast: for they also went unto the feast. 46 So Jesus came again into Cana of Galilee, where he made the water wine. And there was a certain nobleman, whose son was sick at Capernaum. 47 When he heard that Jesus was come out of Judaea into Galilee, he went unto him, and besought him that he would come down, and heal his son: for he was at the point of death. 48 Then said Jesus unto him,Except ye see signs and wonders, ye will not believe. 49 The nobleman saith unto him, Sir, come down ere my child die. 50 Jesus saith unto him,Go thy way; thy son liveth. And the man believed the word that Jesus had spoken unto him, and he went his way. 51 And as he was now going down, his servants met him, and told him, saying*, Thy son liveth. 52 Then enquired he of them the hour when he began to amend. And they said unto him*, Yesterday at the seventh hour the fever left him. 53 So the father knew that it was at the same hour, in the which Jesus said unto him*,Thy son liveth: and himself believed, and his whole house. 54 This is again the second miracle that Jesus did, when he was come out of Judaea into Galilee. So you expect me to search this entire chapter to find your six word quote. And not only that but you expect me to somehow use the King James to do it; a bible that you are not using. Wow! If this is not gaming me then what is it? |
|
dent
Layman
Posts: 61
|
Post by dent on May 27, 2018 1:47:09 GMT -6
I expected nothing of you.
I told you Truth, which you should recall if you've read John over any period of time (assuming you're not a "baby" Spiritually).
If you were uncertain then I would indeed expect you to "chew the cud" which it seems you've done to a very limited point in finding, cutting and pasting the chapter and verse to which I referred.
How difficult would it have been for you to confirm that Jesus did indeed tell the adulterous woman that he was indeed Messiah as I said Truthfully.
Let me do it for you:-
25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things. 26 Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he.
Herein Jesus clearly said "i am messiah" or place capitals where you like. "I AM MESSIAH" has the same meaning. Nothing added or taken away either way (in terms of MEANING!)
Do you require spoon feeding at your spiritual age; which is?
Whatever it is my dear, you need to grow up and take this Man of God seriously! And treat him respectfully! That's what other Scriptures Command!
What I said was TRUTH as I've illustrated.
Dent
|
|
|
|
Post by witness1 on May 27, 2018 4:34:54 GMT -6
"As I urged you when I was going to Macedonia, remain at Ephesus so that you may charge certain persons not to teach any different doctrine, nor to devote themselves to myths and endless genealogies, which promote speculations rather than the stewardship from God that is by faith. The aim of our charge is love that issues from a pure heart and a good conscience and a sincere faith. Certain persons, by swerving from these, have wandered away into vain discussion, desiring to be teachers of the law, without understanding either what they are saying or the things about which they make confident assertions." 1 Timothy 1:3-7
I see a lot of vain discussion here... not a lot of love from a pure heart... and definitely some endless genealogies. I think it's time to move on.
|
|
|
|
Post by yardstick on May 27, 2018 16:47:43 GMT -6
I expected nothing of you. I told you Truth, which you should recall if you've read John over any period of time (assuming you're not a "baby" Spiritually). If you were uncertain then I would indeed expect you to "chew the cud" which it seems you've done to a very limited point in finding, cutting and pasting the chapter and verse to which I referred. How difficult would it have been for you to confirm that Jesus did indeed tell the adulterous woman that he was indeed Messiah as I said Truthfully. Let me do it for you:- 25 The woman saith unto him, I know that Messias cometh, which is called Christ: when he is come, he will tell us all things. 26 Jesus saith unto her, I that speak unto thee am he. Herein Jesus clearly said "i am messiah" or place capitals where you like. "I AM MESSIAH" has the same meaning. Nothing added or taken away either way (in terms of MEANING!) Do you require spoon feeding at your spiritual age; which is?
Whatever it is my dear, you need to grow up and take this Man of God seriously! And treat him respectfully! That's what other Scriptures Command!What I said was TRUTH as I've illustrated. Dent Men of God who are spiritually mature understand the necessity of approaching others with humility and respect. They also know that they do not need to demand same from others. They recognize when others are less matured spiritually than they are; and move to encourage and support others in their growth; not demand recognition and attention for their accomplishments. Please provide evidence that you speak "TRUTH". Your bald assertions have no merit without said evidence. Please explain how it is that you, and you alone have had these insights. Please explain your insights in detail, as if you were speaking to those who did not have the level of understanding you do; and expect to be queried on the details. Expect to be required to provide substantive answers to the questions and disagreements others have. Expect to debate your view vigorously. Also, expect that you may be mistaken. All else is self-centered, self-aggrandizing trolling, subject to warning and further action. Please remember (and review if necessary) the three board rules. Thank you. |
|
|
|
Post by venge on May 29, 2018 13:53:13 GMT -6
I have been watching this thread and I will be honest. It is all confusing because of the indirectness of it.
Dent, please make a clear statement or raise a question to an audience that may not understand. That way, we can interpret it how you address it. Some of your writings are cryptic and that causes confusion.
I think people are trying to follow and ask questions, but having a hard time doing so. Using scripture in a point allows others to read with you and gage in the material with the statement in mind.
|
|
dent
Layman
Posts: 61
|
Post by dent on May 30, 2018 2:48:31 GMT -6
Hi Venge,
I agree that perhaps I've not entered here "on the right foot" so to speak. I'll do my very best to correct the angle of my approach by the means you've suggested.
Hi Yardstick and other mods,
I shall indeed try to oblige you in your requests, both above and in the private message that I was sent.
One of the difficulties that all past prophets faced, was total rejection of their messages in their day. Most, if not all were "killed" by the children of Israel. The "killing" being metaphorical in that to disbelieve is to kill the word; with the word of a person being the person.
My sincere belief is that the whole of Christendom has disbelieved the Word of Jesus and, consequently, the former prophets whose word Jesus fulfilled before "he gave up his Spirit".
If it's all the same to everybody, I'm going to start yet another thread which, my hope is, shall arrive directly at my point. Which is that all of us have been seeking answers the wrong question.
The correct question being "Who is God"?
I do not believe that my entry here on 26 May, and my continuation here this 30 May was or is a mistake. Today is Ascension Day; which is 50 days after Easter and 10 days after Pentecost. The Hebrew date is 16 Sivan 5778.
Kind regards,
Dent
|
|
|
|
Post by venge on May 30, 2018 4:02:48 GMT -6
Hi Venge, I agree that perhaps I've not entered here "on the right foot" so to speak. I'll do my very best to correct the angle of my approach by the means you've suggested. Hi Yardstick and other mods, I shall indeed try to oblige you in your requests, both above and in the private message that I was sent. One of the difficulties that all past prophets faced, was total rejection of their messages in their day. Most, if not all were "killed" by the children of Israel. The "killing" being metaphorical in that to disbelieve is to kill the word; with the word of a person being the person. My sincere belief is that the whole of Christendom has disbelieved the Word of Jesus and, consequently, the former prophets whose word Jesus fulfilled before "he gave up his Spirit". If it's all the same to everybody, I'm going to start yet another thread which, my hope is, shall arrive directly at my point. Which is that all of us have been seeking answers the wrong question. The correct question being "Who is God"? I do not believe that my entry here on 26 May, and my continuation here this 30 May was or is a mistake. Today is Ascension Day; which is 50 days after Easter and 10 days after Pentecost. The Hebrew date is 16 Sivan 5778. Kind regards, Dent In Acts 7, Stephen rebukes the Jews because their ancestors killed the prophets and Jesus. In Luke 11:50-51 Christ says they were responsible for all the dead prophets and those persecuted. If they didn’t die, why did he say they built their tombs out of honor but they killed them out of malice? |
|
dent
Layman
Posts: 61
|
Post by dent on May 30, 2018 5:32:06 GMT -6
Hi Venge, I agree that perhaps I've not entered here "on the right foot" so to speak. I'll do my very best to correct the angle of my approach by the means you've suggested. Hi Yardstick and other mods, I shall indeed try to oblige you in your requests, both above and in the private message that I was sent. One of the difficulties that all past prophets faced, was total rejection of their messages in their day. Most, if not all were "killed" by the children of Israel. The "killing" being metaphorical in that to disbelieve is to kill the word; with the word of a person being the person. My sincere belief is that the whole of Christendom has disbelieved the Word of Jesus and, consequently, the former prophets whose word Jesus fulfilled before "he gave up his Spirit". If it's all the same to everybody, I'm going to start yet another thread which, my hope is, shall arrive directly at my point. Which is that all of us have been seeking answers the wrong question. The correct question being "Who is God"? I do not believe that my entry here on 26 May, and my continuation here this 30 May was or is a mistake. Today is Ascension Day; which is 50 days after Easter and 10 days after Pentecost. The Hebrew date is 16 Sivan 5778. Kind regards, Dent In Acts 7, Stephen rebukes the Jews because their ancestors killed the prophets and Jesus. In Luke 11:50-51 Christ says they were responsible for all the dead prophets and those persecuted. If they didn’t die, why did he say they built their tombs out of honor but they killed them out of malice? Jesus did indeed rebuke the Jews for killing the prophets (His self included). But where are their tombs, according to Acts? There's none existing, nor records that there ever were any. Are there? There's absolutely no record of any prophet having been murdered, is there? The two referenced were Abel who was killed by Cain (not a Jew?) and a priest (not a prophet). With not even the hint of Jews literally killing every prophet. So why did Luke, through Acts, say there were multiple murders of every prophet from A to Z? Dent |
|
|
|
Post by venge on May 30, 2018 5:58:40 GMT -6
In Acts 7, Stephen rebukes the Jews because their ancestors killed the prophets and Jesus. In Luke 11:50-51 Christ says they were responsible for all the dead prophets and those persecuted. If they didn’t die, why did he say they built their tombs out of honor but they killed them out of malice? Jesus did indeed rebuke the Jews for killing the prophets (His self included). But where are their tombs, according to Acts? There's none existing, nor records that there ever were any. Are there? There's absolutely no record of any prophet having been murdered, is there? The two referenced were Abel who was killed by Cain (not a Jew?) and a priest (not a prophet). With not even the hint of Jews literally killing every prophet. So why did Luke, through Acts, say there were multiple murders of every prophet from A to Z? Dent It was a chronological order from the first OT man that died, Abel in righteousness, through Zechariah that died between the alter and the sanctuary. It is the entire grouping of OT martyrs thru those 2. The first and last. The Pharisees approved all the wickedness in the name of law all the way to killing Christ. Therefore, Christ condemned them and their generation for it. |
|
