|
|
Post by venge on Apr 20, 2018 12:01:24 GMT -6
venge , Don't read this as harsh, it's just a few questions I have and I am looking for honest answers. Of course you aren't obligated to answer any of them, but I hope you will. This seems appropriate for the thread as titled. First of all, few of us here would say we all agree on all points of scripture, be it prophecy or otherwise. However, most of us would say that we agree on most of the most important points of Christian doctrine. For instance, most here would say that we can agree that salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, and not of works. I hope you'd count yourself in agreement with us on that one. Prophecy is a little different in that within the Church there are divergent opinions on how the "end times" will play out (...now we see dimly...). Premillennialism, Postmillennialism, Amillenialism, Pre-Mid-Post trib raptures, etc. And within these, there are many sub-groups as well. But these are very well established and documented points of view that have been held by various denominations in the Church for many years, most of which can be traced back hundreds of years, if not to the very beginning of the Church. Getting to my question...I can't help but notice that invariably, you seem to have a different understanding of almost any of the long held Christian beliefs regarding the prophetic scriptures that are espoused here by various participants. You seem to have a different take on just about anything posted here. Most troubling to me is that I don't recognize most of your stances. Now, I am most familiar with my own beliefs on prophecy and as you know I am Pre-trib and Pre-Mill, but to be sure, I am far less knowledgeable on the other views. And let me clearly state, no one has it all right. No denomination or group of Christian thought has all points of scripture perfect...and we are called to study...all of us, individually and not to blindly trust any denomination or "camp". However, I think most here would say that they align with a particular set of long held Christian doctrine on things prophetic and otherwise. Most here could write a "statement of faith" listing their core beliefs and those would roughly align with some group of Christians that hold to the same common beliefs. In most case that would be a denomination, but doesn't have to be. (I'm not pushing denominations. I think they serve a role, but unfortunately, have splintered the Church. However, it is the way things have panned out.) My questions: 1. Do you fall into one one the 3 main eschatalogical camps mentioned above or have you "rolled your own"? Or perhaps there is another I've excluded? 2. If you have "rolled your own", which camp do you think you most closely align with? 3. Do you have a denominational affiliation? If so, would you share it? You see, I hear you saying stuff that in my time following Jesus and studying His word (over 40 years) I have never heard before. In and of itself that's not necessarily a bad thing. It could just be that you espouse one of these aforementioned eschatalogical views (or another) and I am simply ignorant of it and it's finer points. I am certainly no theologian! But I have to tell you, I am always skeptical regarding "new revelation". Stuff I hear that doesn't align with any of these views causes an eyebrow to raise. Because men of God, brilliant theological minds, have been studying these things for 2000 years. If I hear an eschatalogical viewpoint I've never heard before I tend to ask myself..."wow, how did they miss that?" And I for one think it's highly unlikely that God is revealing "new stuff" at this point in human history as I think we are nearing the end of the Church Age. Again, maybe your understanding is not "new", maybe I am just ignorant of a particular doctrinal stance you espouse. Please enlighten me (and the rest of us here) on where you are coming from. I'm am just trying to establish a point of reference for your theology/eschatology. Perhaps you'll say "it's scripture". Perhaps you don't align with any documented Christian eschatology. That's an acceptable answer too, but at least I'll know. No problem. As a Christian I want my life to be an open book. If I cannot share with you, how would I share when I witness? I grew up Pre Trib. 100 and 10% Pre Trib. Had books, charts etc. I’m very well versed in everything taught within that doctrine from study, reading and my church. I belong to a independent fundamental bible believing Baptist Church. I enjoy long teaching sessions. Not in a rush to leave church. I’m there to learn, apply and worship my creator. One day, I prayed for a gift. I had no gift I could recognize. I don’t know if I do today, but I didn’t want to waste a gift if I had it and I could glorify God with it. I prayed for prophecy. A few days later before bed I asked God what’s the purpose of the rapture and the tribulation. I woke up the next morning with a book, a chapter and a verse on my mind. I didn’t know the words of the verse. Just woke up that way. I grabbed my Bible and looked it up. It answers my question. I started studying harder then. As I studied I noticed things in my life that were not good. When I got to the wedding feast and the unclothed ma who was thrown out. I thought, iniquity....that could be me. But I had Christ! I can’t lose my salvation. But remember in the 7 churches it says I can blot out your name from the book of life. Or you can lose your crown. God doesn’t make idle threats. It is a warning. I started looking at myself. Stopped listening to certain music. Stopped watching inappropriate TV shows. Slowly changing. Anyway, My prophecy started changing like God allowed me to see. I can only explain it like foggy eyes to clearer eyes. I’m not special but when it happened I was focused. I wrote a lot of notes and then realized it’s not for me. It’s for others if they want to read. Now I know most are Pre Trib. But I have to present it or some may never know. I don’t have all the answers to the 24 elders. But I’m dead 100% on my position. So, I lean post Trib but not the 7th trumpet. Post Trib because Christ says after the Tribulation. But I would say the rapture happens after the astral event. I believe in being saved by grace thru faith. Works cannot save but faith without works is dead faith. I believe in offerings not tithes. I believe in sanctification. I believe in baptism by immersion. I believe in the trinity. I believe in John 3:16. I believe in a literal hell and heaven. I believe in a literal Christ reigning for 1k years after Daniels 70th week. I believe the Bible is the man written Infallible inspired word of God almighty. Hope I got it all 🤗 |
|
|
|
Post by venge on Apr 20, 2018 14:14:04 GMT -6
3: I have never understood or have been shown with absolute certainty that the 1st Seal is the start of this tribulation. John was weeping because no one was found worthy to open the seals, then “Stop weeping; behold, the Lion that is from the tribe of Judah, the Root of David, has overcome so as to open the book and its seven seals.” Where is it that syas the Jesus waits until now to open the 1st seal? Why can't Jesus begin the process of His Revealing once He gets to the throne from the start? The first 4 seals are like "headlines" in a newspaper, and do not contain judgement or destruction... Because the 24 Elders must be present for Revelation chapter 5 to be true. The Church IS the 24 Elders. Before a single seal can be opened, the Church has to be in heaven for this prophecy to be true. We cannot say in the definitive that the 24 elders are the church. There is not enough evidence. Not yet anyway. Again that speculation. I will say that though I disagree with the 24 elders being believers, I will say there are some characteristics that I understand are roadblocks. Crowns on their heads, white robes..etc but the problem lies with verses that disagree with it. Mid Trib, Pre Trib, Post Trib, pick a Trib.....they all find the elders difficult. Now pre Trib will point out some things that have hallmarks to Christians. I agree. But there are other issues many pre Trib have identified we cannot conclusively answer 100%. I am studying it and when I feel confidant I’ll write something up. Outside of all opinion, we know from Daniel there will be a time of trouble that has never been seen, Christ says great tribulation, and at that time everyone in the book of life will be raised. I look back and think how far we’ve come in prophecy. 2k years ago, they were not near the interpretations we have today. God allows more and more to be understood. Prayerfully, he will open it to us before that time happens. |
|
|
|
Post by fitz on Apr 20, 2018 15:54:23 GMT -6
venge , Don't read this as harsh, it's just a few questions I have and I am looking for honest answers. Of course you aren't obligated to answer any of them, but I hope you will. This seems appropriate for the thread as titled. First of all, few of us here would say we all agree on all points of scripture, be it prophecy or otherwise. However, most of us would say that we agree on most of the most important points of Christian doctrine. For instance, most here would say that we can agree that salvation is by grace alone, through faith alone, and not of works. I hope you'd count yourself in agreement with us on that one. Prophecy is a little different in that within the Church there are divergent opinions on how the "end times" will play out (...now we see dimly...). Premillennialism, Postmillennialism, Amillenialism, Pre-Mid-Post trib raptures, etc. And within these, there are many sub-groups as well. But these are very well established and documented points of view that have been held by various denominations in the Church for many years, most of which can be traced back hundreds of years, if not to the very beginning of the Church. Getting to my question...I can't help but notice that invariably, you seem to have a different understanding of almost any of the long held Christian beliefs regarding the prophetic scriptures that are espoused here by various participants. You seem to have a different take on just about anything posted here. Most troubling to me is that I don't recognize most of your stances. Now, I am most familiar with my own beliefs on prophecy and as you know I am Pre-trib and Pre-Mill, but to be sure, I am far less knowledgeable on the other views. And let me clearly state, no one has it all right. No denomination or group of Christian thought has all points of scripture perfect...and we are called to study...all of us, individually and not to blindly trust any denomination or "camp". However, I think most here would say that they align with a particular set of long held Christian doctrine on things prophetic and otherwise. Most here could write a "statement of faith" listing their core beliefs and those would roughly align with some group of Christians that hold to the same common beliefs. In most case that would be a denomination, but doesn't have to be. (I'm not pushing denominations. I think they serve a role, but unfortunately, have splintered the Church. However, it is the way things have panned out.) My questions: 1. Do you fall into one one the 3 main eschatalogical camps mentioned above or have you "rolled your own"? Or perhaps there is another I've excluded? 2. If you have "rolled your own", which camp do you think you most closely align with? 3. Do you have a denominational affiliation? If so, would you share it? You see, I hear you saying stuff that in my time following Jesus and studying His word (over 40 years) I have never heard before. In and of itself that's not necessarily a bad thing. It could just be that you espouse one of these aforementioned eschatalogical views (or another) and I am simply ignorant of it and it's finer points. I am certainly no theologian! But I have to tell you, I am always skeptical regarding "new revelation". Stuff I hear that doesn't align with any of these views causes an eyebrow to raise. Because men of God, brilliant theological minds, have been studying these things for 2000 years. If I hear an eschatalogical viewpoint I've never heard before I tend to ask myself..."wow, how did they miss that?" And I for one think it's highly unlikely that God is revealing "new stuff" at this point in human history as I think we are nearing the end of the Church Age. Again, maybe your understanding is not "new", maybe I am just ignorant of a particular doctrinal stance you espouse. Please enlighten me (and the rest of us here) on where you are coming from. I'm am just trying to establish a point of reference for your theology/eschatology. Perhaps you'll say "it's scripture". Perhaps you don't align with any documented Christian eschatology. That's an acceptable answer too, but at least I'll know. No problem. As a Christian I want my life to be an open book. If I cannot share with you, how would I share when I witness? I grew up Pre Trib. 100 and 10% Pre Trib. Had books, charts etc. I’m very well versed in everything taught within that doctrine from study, reading and my church. I belong to a independent fundamental bible believing Baptist Church. I enjoy long teaching sessions. Not in a rush to leave church. I’m there to learn, apply and worship my creator. One day, I prayed for a gift. I had no gift I could recognize. I don’t know if I do today, but I didn’t want to waste a gift if I had it and I could glorify God with it. I prayed for prophecy. A few days later before bed I asked God what’s the purpose of the rapture and the tribulation. I woke up the next morning with a book, a chapter and a verse on my mind. I didn’t know the words of the verse. Just woke up that way. I grabbed my Bible and looked it up. It answers my question. I started studying harder then. As I studied I noticed things in my life that were not good. When I got to the wedding feast and the unclothed ma who was thrown out. I thought, iniquity....that could be me. But I had Christ! I can’t lose my salvation. But remember in the 7 churches it says I can blot out your name from the book of life. Or you can lose your crown. God doesn’t make idle threats. It is a warning. I started looking at myself. Stopped listening to certain music. Stopped watching inappropriate TV shows. Slowly changing. Anyway, My prophecy started changing like God allowed me to see. I can only explain it like foggy eyes to clearer eyes. I’m not special but when it happened I was focused. I wrote a lot of notes and then realized it’s not for me. It’s for others if they want to read. Now I know most are Pre Trib. But I have to present it or some may never know. I don’t have all the answers to the 24 elders. But I’m dead 100% on my position. So, I lean post Trib but not the 7th trumpet. Post Trib because Christ says after the Tribulation. But I would say the rapture happens after the astral event. I believe in being saved by grace thru faith. Works cannot save but faith without works is dead faith. I believe in offerings not tithes. I believe in sanctification. I believe in baptism by immersion. I believe in the trinity. I believe in John 3:16. I believe in a literal hell and heaven. I believe in a literal Christ reigning for 1k years after Daniels 70th week. I believe the Bible is the man written Infallible inspired word of God almighty. Hope I got it all 🤗 Thank you Venge. I appreciate your honesty. I still don't agree with you on many things, but that's OK.  |
|
|
|
Post by fitz on Apr 20, 2018 15:56:33 GMT -6
Because the 24 Elders must be present for Revelation chapter 5 to be true. The Church IS the 24 Elders. Before a single seal can be opened, the Church has to be in heaven for this prophecy to be true. We cannot say in the definitive that the 24 elders are the church. There is not enough evidence. Not yet anyway. Again that speculation. I will say that though I disagree with the 24 elders being believers, I will say there are some characteristics that I understand are roadblocks. Crowns on their heads, white robes..etc but the problem lies with verses that disagree with it. Mid Trib, Pre Trib, Post Trib, pick a Trib.....they all find the elders difficult. Now pre Trib will point out some things that have hallmarks to Christians. I agree. But there are other issues many pre Trib have identified we cannot conclusively answer 100%. I am studying it and when I feel confidant I’ll write something up. Outside of all opinion, we know from Daniel there will be a time of trouble that has never been seen, Christ says great tribulation, and at that time everyone in the book of life will be raised. I look back and think how far we’ve come in prophecy. 2k years ago, they were not near the interpretations we have today. God allows more and more to be understood. Prayerfully, he will open it to us before that time happens. Well, let me just say...I can believe it, and I do. It makes far too much sense to me, and many others as well. This is one of those things I think we will not know for certain until we know for certain. For now, it's all about faith. |
|
|
|
Post by fitz on Apr 20, 2018 18:06:46 GMT -6
As an addendum to his article outlining why the 24 elders HAVE to be the raptured church, I found this article (about WHY Jesus opens the seals when we get to heaven and not beforehand) very convincing. It was also very encouraging and convicting to my personal walk with the Lord. I really need to re-read it because it has been awhile and it was REALLY good. I feel like I would do the article a disservice to try to give a brief summary for you, but hopefully you will have time to read it for yourself. Then perhaps we can discuss. www.alittlestrength.com/articles/2017/1712-missing-piece.htmThank you witness1. A wonderful article and it helped me too. So encouraging to be reminded about the things you know that you know, but sometimes lose track of. |
|
|
|
Post by Natalie on Apr 20, 2018 19:48:45 GMT -6
Yes, thank you witness.
|
|
blur
New Member
Posts: 49 
|
Post by blur on Apr 21, 2018 12:57:23 GMT -6
Because the 24 Elders must be present for Revelation chapter 5 to be true. The Church IS the 24 Elders. Before a single seal can be opened, the Church has to be in heaven for this prophecy to be true. We cannot say in the definitive that the 24 elders are the church. There is not enough evidence. Not yet anyway. Again that speculation. I will say that though I disagree with the 24 elders being believers, I will say there are some characteristics that I understand are roadblocks. Crowns on their heads, white robes..etc but the problem lies with verses that disagree with it. Mid Trib, Pre Trib, Post Trib, pick a Trib.....they all find the elders difficult. Now pre Trib will point out some things that have hallmarks to Christians. I agree. But there are other issues many pre Trib have identified we cannot conclusively answer 100%. I am studying it and when I feel confidant I’ll write something up. Outside of all opinion, we know from Daniel there will be a time of trouble that has never been seen, Christ says great tribulation, and at that time everyone in the book of life will be raised. I look back and think how far we’ve come in prophecy. 2k years ago, they were not near the interpretations we have today. God allows more and more to be understood. Prayerfully, he will open it to us before that time happens. Imo, there are many aspects about the 'rapture' notion that create a lot of problems understanding eschatology. 1st, the notion of the 'gathering' being a 'whisked away rapture' creates the mistaken notion that it all happens 'instantaneously' (with an emphasis on it being God's choice) rather than the process of gathering that it is (with an emphasis on individual choice - not to worship the abomination). (can we agree that the 'great multitude' of Revelation 7 & the 'come up here' at the end of the 2nd woe/ 6th Trumpet, start of the 7th trumpet/ 7 bowls of wrath represent the 'rapture' that is quoted by various verses? In this manner, 'at the sound of the trumpet' means at the 1st Trumpet & at the 7th Trumpet' - in other words, the 2 examples of the great multitude & the 'come up here'. So, there have already been people pointing out the fact that there appear to be 2 'raptures', which doesn't make much sense. But if we view it as a process, then it is not really problematic. At the 1st instance, the 'great multitude' that has been brought out of the 'great tribulation' (Rev 7:14) is the 10 virgins (same as Joel 2:32's all who call on the name of the Lord shall be saved) this is the 'kingdom of heaven - on earth, that started at the Day of the Lord. Clearly, Jesus is not talking about 'heaven' (in 'heaven') is he? He's talking about the kingdom of heaven on earth (that's why there is the '1/3' portion denoted in the first 4 Trumpets - it is not an amount per se, it is referring to 3 different portions: heaven, sea, and earth. the 'beast from the sea & earth' are the other 2 portions. The 'dragon' rules out of Jerusalem and appoints the kingdoms of the sea & earth. more on this next post) As to the 2nd instance, someone might respond with that the 2 witnesses are told to 'come up here' - that is a pretty literal 'going up to heaven', but is that what it really means? Let's look at Luke 14:7-11 7 Now he told a parable to those who were invited, when he noticed how they chose the places of honor, saying to them, 8“When you are invited by someone to a wedding feast, do not sit down in a place of honor, lest someone more distinguished than you be invited by him, 9and he who invited you both will come and say to you, ‘Give your place to this person,’ and then you will begin with shame to take the lowest place. 10 But when you are invited, go and sit in the lowest place, so that when your host comes he may say to you, ‘Friend, move up higher.’ Then you will be honored in the presence of all who sit at table with you. 11 For everyone who exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted.”this parable is in conjunction with Matt 23
During the 2nd woe, the 2 witnesses are preaching to people who are outwardly very religious but actually evil. At the end of the 2 witnesses testimony, they will be told to 'come up here' / 'move up higher'. The humble will be exalted. Also, the 'whisked away' rapture seems to feed into the notion that God is a literal person living on a literal planet - 'in heaven' (it will probably be said to be Mars, because 'Adam' means 'red earth' - Mars being the 'red planet' and Jesus was a type of Adam). Because the 'strong delusion' is at least partly pharmacological in nature (the 'sorcery' of Rev 18:23 is 'pharmakia' ie 'drugs for sorcery'), I suspect that what is promoted as 'a whisked away rapture' will be replicated with drugs - eg Ketamine is said to produce 'out of body experiences' which to a normal person would be experienced as a 'failed rapture'. Put another way, the 'left behind' will have an incentive to go to outer space which they would think of as 'home' (but in reality, this is the 'unprofitable servant being cast into the outer darkness'). this religious world view seems to be the one that will be believed by the outwardly religious of the 2nd woe. Matt 13:24-30 |
|
blur
New Member
Posts: 49
|
Post by blur on Apr 21, 2018 14:21:30 GMT -6
We cannot say in the definitive that the 24 elders are the church. There is not enough evidence. Not yet anyway. Again that speculation. I will say that though I disagree with the 24 elders being believers, I will say there are some characteristics that I understand are roadblocks. Crowns on their heads, white robes..etc but the problem lies with verses that disagree with it. Mid Trib, Pre Trib, Post Trib, pick a Trib.....they all find the elders difficult. Now pre Trib will point out some things that have hallmarks to Christians. I agree. But there are other issues many pre Trib have identified we cannot conclusively answer 100%. I am studying it and when I feel confidant I’ll write something up. Outside of all opinion, we know from Daniel there will be a time of trouble that has never been seen, Christ says great tribulation, and at that time everyone in the book of life will be raised. I look back and think how far we’ve come in prophecy. 2k years ago, they were not near the interpretations we have today. God allows more and more to be understood. Prayerfully, he will open it to us before that time happens. cont'd Matt 13:24-30 The people that refuse the mark & don't worship the abomination will be gathered by the messengers/ angels of God. The people that will worship the beast are gathered by the antichrist & false prophet. to see how this plays out in time, here is how it goes imo. Malachi 4:5 new Elijah before the Day of the Lord Daniel 12 10 Many shall purify themselves and make themselves white and be refined, but the wicked shall act wickedly. And none of the wicked shall understand, but those who are wise shall understand. 11 And from the time that the regular burnt offering is taken away and the abomination that makes desolate is set up, there shall be 1,290 days. 12 Blessed is he who waits and arrives at the 1,335 days. 13 But go your way till the end. And you shall rest and shall stand in your allotted place at the end of the days.” the 1335 days start 1st: new Elijah/ new Jonah in the belly of the whale for 3 days 1Then the word of the Lord came to Jonah the second time, saying, 2“Arise, go to Nineveh, that great city, and call out against it the message that I tell you.” 3So Jonah arose and went to Nineveh, according to the word of the Lord. Now Nineveh was an exceedingly great city, three days’ journey in breadth. 4 Jonah began to go into the city, going a day’s journey. And he called out, “Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown!” 5 And the people of Nineveh believed God. They called for a fast and put on sackcloth, from the greatest of them to the least of them. (If one looks at Daniel 9:24-27, we find the material for the Seals. the 70th anniversary of Israel parallels the 70 years of desolations of Jerusalem - 5 Iyyar, 5778 // dusk April 19, day of April 20, 2018) just pay attention to the time amounts given: 7 weeks, then 62 weeks, then 62 weeks, then 8 weeks ('until the end' - 70 weeks to finish the transgression). Then the 7 day covenant is made and broken 3.5 days later. 1st Seal: white horseman (June 8, 2018, 7 weeks after April 20, 2018) the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks 2nd Seal: red horseman/ war (after June 8, 2018) "the people of the prince who is to come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary. Its end shall come with a flood, and to the end there shall be war." 3rd Seal: black horseman/ famine (after June 8, 2018) "Desolations are decreed. " (Desolation of land = famine. EG Job 30:3 Through want and hard hunger they gnaw the dry ground by night in waste and desolation;) 4th Seal: Death and Hades are given dominion over 1/4 of the earth (Aug 16, 2019; 69 weeks after the 70th anniversary of the desolations of Jerusalem, April 20, 2018) (when the 'prince/ ruler' becomes 'anointed'/ becomes the 'messiah', then they are given 'dominion'.) "25 Know therefore and understand that from the going out of the word to restore and build Jerusalem to the coming of an anointed one, a prince, there shall be seven weeks. Then for sixty-two weeks it shall be built again with squares and moat, but in a troubled time." (7 + 62 = 69 weeks, then 'anointed' messiah) 5th Seal: Martyrs (after Death & Hades are given dominion: Aug 16, 2019 until the abomination of desolation on Dec 21, 2020) People killed by the 7th head of Satan. the 'covenant' is made 70 weeks after the 69th week where the anointed one is anointed ('messiah' means 'anointed') (Dec 18, 2020). 6th Seal: Abomination of desolation 27 And he shall make a strong covenant with many for one week, and in the middle of the week he shall put an end to sacrifice and offering. And on the wing of abominations shall come one who makes desolate, until the decreed end is poured out on the desolator.” - the 'prince/ ruler to come' 'makes/ confirms the covenant in the middle of 1 week/ 7 days' (Dec 18, 2020)
- the 'prince/ ruler to come' breaks the covenant in the middle of the 7 days'
- the abomination of desolation shows up in Jerusalem (Dec 21, 2020, the 'winter' solstice referenced in Matthew 24:20) (start the 1335 days)
- new Jonah in the belly of the whale for 3 days
- arrives at 'New Nineveh' (ie Jerusalem), travels for 1 day
- 'In 40 days, 'Jerusalem shall be overthrown'
- 45th day, starts the Day of the Lord, God's wrath, the start of 1290 days, Jerusalem is taken over by Apollyon or Abaddon - as punishment
- 5 months (147 days, 5 lunar months) of locusts taking over (the 5 months of the 5th trumpet)
- At the end of 5 months, start of the 6th Trumpet/ 2nd woe (takeover of the USA, July 4, 2021)
- The inner court of the 'sanctuary' is taken over for 1143 days (the 1150 days of 2300 'evenings & mornings' of Daniel 8 - 1143 days + 7 days to cleanse = 1150) (147 + 1143 = 1290 days of Daniel 12:11)
- The outer court is taken over for 1260 days, the 1260 days of the 2 witnesses. at the end of the 1260 days, (start the 'year of recompense', start of the 7 bowls of wrath ) the end of this year of recompense coincides with 69 weeks after the end of the trampling of the inner court (the 1290th day + 69 weeks = 1260 days + 1 year). Also coincides with the 77th anniversary of Israel + 7 months of clean-up of Gog (May 13, 2025 + 7 months to get to Dec 13, 2025)
The inner court of the 'sanctuary' is taken over for 1143 days (the 1150 days of 2300 'evenings & mornings' of Daniel 8 - 1143 days + 7 days to cleanse = 1150) (147 + 1143 = 1290 days of Daniel 12:11) The outer court is taken over for 1260 days, the 1260 days of the 2 witnesses at the end of the 1260 days, (start the 'year of recompense', start of the 7 bowls of wrath ) the end of this year of recompense coincides with 69 weeks after the end of the trampling of the inner court (the 1290th day + 69 weeks = 1260 days + 1 year). Also coincides with the 77th solar year anniversary of Israel + 7 months of clean-up of Gog (May 13, 2025 + 7 months to get to Dec 13, 2025) Apollyon takes over the city & the sanctuary. 1st, Apollyon takes over the 'city' (which has a literal 'sanctuary') and then 5 months later, takes over a metaphorical / spiritual sanctuary. When the Day of the Lord starts, the deceived think it is the start of the kingdom of heaven. This is the manner by which the tares are gathered (see Matt 13 above again). People who refuse the mark of the beast will be gathered (for survival). |
|
|
|
Post by venge on May 27, 2018 19:29:24 GMT -6
So Jerusalem will be destroyed on June 8th, 2018?
Edit on 6/3/18
Will have to revisit this on June 8th
|
|
