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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 4, 2017 20:54:13 GMT -6
Whoops as an aside, I have to add that my last statement needs some clarification...as anybody worldwide that refuses to take the Mark gets a blessing from the Lord, for not bowing down to the idol or the God of this world called the Anti-Christ. Any that decide to die of starvation will get a blessing for refusing the economic Mark of commerce...
Anyone of any religion..... not just Christianity....
Any Jew that tells them, to Hell with you, ******** take your Mark and ***** **** *** **** ***, the Lord will bless.
Any Muslim that says the same thing in Arabic etc...., the Lord will bless
Any atheist that refuses the Mark because he refuses to obey man made authority, gets a blessing.
So lets reach all of them with the message of REFUSE THE MARK, .... such refusal as noted will surely kill them....but their hearts go on and their spirits will go on.
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Post by thetimeoftheend on Dec 4, 2017 21:11:10 GMT -6
You said a whole lot there... So if I understand correctly you don't take the literal interpretation that they are Israelites from each of the 12 tribes, but rather a methaporical interpretation because they haven't earned that place? Would it be safe then to say you subscribe to replacement theology?
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Post by thetimeoftheend on Dec 4, 2017 21:14:42 GMT -6
I actually think I found an answer to that question in another post of yours on another thread. While I fully and totally disagree with you - it does help me to better understand some of the things you are posting.
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Post by mike on Dec 5, 2017 7:26:55 GMT -6
davidjayjordan one page back you stated: Since we know that verse 1-2 happened 9/23/17, if that is correct where does the rest of chapter 12 fit in? I guess to better ask the question...If chapter 1-2 etc. was shortly after the resurrection how does the rest of the book fall on a timeline?
2000 years from chapter 1 to 12, which is very possible and rt does a great job expressing that here (just dont recall which page). Does your understanding mean there is another 1500-2000 years for the next 10 chapters to occur or was the Great Sign a marker/sign to say the time is now counting down at an accelerated pace?
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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 5, 2017 9:04:38 GMT -6
You said a whole lot there... So if I understand correctly you don't take the literal interpretation that they are Israelites from each of the 12 tribes, but rather a methaporical interpretation because they haven't earned that place? Would it be safe then to say you subscribe to replacement theology? No the literal translation is that we Christians are put in tribes....... and we are literally the chosen ones, as we have chosen the CHOSEN ONE...Jesus. As explained, Revelations deals with Christians and is a Christian book, and was written for Christians And did not change mid stream and substitute Jewish people into the end times, because they donot know the Lord... Therefore as mentioned we should reach them, even though the Pope said they should not be evangelized. Jacob was Israel, or became Israel once he learned not to trick, and not trust in bloodline blessings. IN Christianity, its always CHOICE and never automated blessings just because of parentage, bloodlines, etc.. *************** But if you believe the Jews are the chosen ones rather than Christians, thats your right ! If you think they will lead, even though unbelievers in the End Time, thats your right to your interpretation or replacement theory. Your choice, your discernment |
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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 5, 2017 9:13:59 GMT -6
davidjayjordan one page back you stated: Since we know that verse 1-2 happened 9/23/17, if that is correct where does the rest of chapter 12 fit in? I guess to better ask the question...If chapter 1-2 etc. was shortly after the resurrection how does the rest of the book fall on a timeline?
2000 years from chapter 1 to 12, which is very possible and rt does a great job expressing that here (just dont recall which page). Does your understanding mean there is another 1500-2000 years for the next 10 chapters to occur or was the Great Sign a marker/sign to say the time is now counting down at an accelerated pace? Do explain what chapter 1, and 2 verses are in... Revelation chapters 1 and 2, are chronological... 7 churches, 7 seals, 7 trumpets, 7 vials.... Chapter 12 is us, Christians fleeing into the wilderness as Jesus told us Christians, His Bride to flee to .... (Petra). This where He promised us, He had prepared for us and would provide for us, and protect us, just as He had protected Moses and the first Exodus.... Exact parallel, except ours is the greatest EXODUS. We're lead by our Christian leader and Priest, the Two witnesses.... even as Moses and Aaron lead in the first exodus. Moses had a mixed multitude that didnt believe, but we shall have believers in Christ, so as to make it much much easier.... We dont get raptured as the Lord wants us to fulfill all his prophecy as He trusts us to obey and follow til the End... Rev 12 exactly 1260 days of the Great Tribulation when we Christians, follow til the end. Accelerated pace.... NO, the prescribed pace... Its the prophetic pace as mentioned. It starts with the Covenant signing and ends with the Lords Return, our festive Marriage Feast and then His return with us Christians down to the battle of Armeggeddon. The pace is shown by the timeframes and each must be fulfilled exactly, so lets get it exactly right.. Or at least recognize the next prophetic events... as in the Mid East War that necessitates the COVENANT signing.. |
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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 5, 2017 9:15:40 GMT -6
Mike, getting the chronological order down, means you can insert, Chapters and verses and timeframes on your timeline. So rather than focusing on one event that you might get wrong, try establishing all the events in with all the times and requirements, and then the trees become much much clearer rather than a forest of trees.
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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 5, 2017 9:27:24 GMT -6
Ok, lets finnish off the pace or the determined times, as the vials or bowls if you prefer..... are released in 45 days.... a much shorter time frame, because now we are not HERE on Earth, we have finally been Raptured and our job is up, and we are partying with the Lord, our Bridegroom.... before we ALL return and defeat the Ac, FP and His evil MARKED ONES.
1355 - 1290 days yields 45 days and means we have an exact count of days from August 10, 25 til Sept 22..Rosh Hannah of 2025. From harvest to harvest..
So now, no more mercy on the Earth or those worshipping the Beast, and His Image and His Mark (Again note Kristie's verse Rev. 20:4)... so its full strength destruction and judgment, not 1/3 strength but FULL ON< as the Lord has no more patience, they have chosen poorly and sold their souls out, so He pours it on them in true righteous judgment, for true and righteous are His Judgments.
One after another, no pauses in between. 7 judgments in 45 days..
Didnt read the time frames between them, but it can easily be done if there are any, and the discernment would vary slightly..it matters not, they are fast and furious.. and culminate in the Battle of Armegedon as per usual the dam devil thinks he will win the Battle so gathers his forces. in the valley of Meggido, in the worldly nation called Egypt, or Israel. (Rev 11:8)
So there again this substitution theory or interpretation in thinking Israel refers to the Lords country, is incorrect IMO... as Revelation 11 distinctly says Jerusalem is Egypt and Sodom...... with Egypt being a country and Sodom being a vile city... the angel of Jesus did not say Israel was the Lords country. For again "all nations are as nothing to HIM...and at that time, all nations worship and serve the Beast. Not some , all countries follow the AC....
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Post by mike on Dec 5, 2017 10:00:42 GMT -6
David,
Maybe I didnt articulate my question very well. On September 23rd 2017 we saw the great sign of Revelation 12:1-2 occur. No debating that prophecy was fulfilled, it absolutely was.
you state Revelation is in chronological order, which I can believe to a degree. However we are now 73 days beyond 9/23 and according to your comment:
we are already 73 days deep into the great tribulation.
This leaves several unanswered questions about chapter 12
1. What or where is the other sign mentioned in verses 3-4
2. Was the male child brought forth (verses 5-6) and if so what does he was caught up to his throne mean?
3. and who is the woman from verse 6 who would now be in the wilderness?
According to a post or two in another thread and above, you feel the woman is the church not Israel.
4. So shouldnt that EXODUS of Christians have begun already?
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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 5, 2017 11:16:59 GMT -6
I differ greatly, the Tribulation has not started, and again the Great TRIBULATION has not started.
The Trib of 7 years starts with the Covenant signing that has not happened yet.
The Great Trib starts with the setting up of the abomination of desolation in the Holy of Holies and the 3rd temple cant get started til the Covenant itself is signed Besides the Ac has not enetered Jeruselem either nor went into the 3rd Tmple and declared himself God, so Yes, I would differ and debate those interpretations.
So IMO from prophetic scriptures 9/23 is not a date of importance nor a starting day count.
You can have it as your start point on your time line, but it doesnt negate mine.
But Yes, if you have a timeline I would love to see it.
ATBIJ
David
I'll respond to your 4 other queries after I do my work for my darling... my other to do lists.... come first..... wives are a blessing.
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Post by mike on Dec 5, 2017 13:02:10 GMT -6
David - it appears you are contradicting yourself. I stated that the Rev 12:1-2 Great Sign occurred on 9/23, which you appear to dismiss. The Great Sign happened and according to what you wrote, we are 73 days into Revelation 12. How can 9/23 not be an important date? Unfortunately I wont settle for your opinion on it unless its backed with substance from scripture.
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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 5, 2017 17:07:42 GMT -6
David, Maybe I didnt articulate my question very well. On September 23rd 2017 we saw the great sign of Revelation 12:1-2 occur. No debating that prophecy was fulfilled, it absolutely was. you state Revelation is in chronological order, which I can believe to a degree. However we are now 73 days beyond 9/23 and according to your comment: we are already 73 days deep into the great tribulation. This leaves several unanswered questions about chapter 12 1. What or where is the other sign mentioned in verses 3-4 2. Was the male child brought forth (verses 5-6) and if so what does he was caught up to his throne mean? 3. and who is the woman from verse 6 who would now be in the wilderness? According to a post or two in another thread and above, you feel the woman is the church not Israel. 4. So shouldnt that EXODUS of Christians have begun already? No, IMO...the seals, then trumpets, then vials are in chronological order..... the chapters explain them more fully, when you place them each in their time frame. 9/23 has no corelation that I know of, as I would debate that date or event.... I think you are saying it was the Start of the Great Tribulation. But Mike, back in September there was no Covenant, no start of sacrificing, no nuclear war, No AC entering the 3rd Temple, as there still is no 3rd Temple, and there is no abomination of desolation, and Mark worldwide, where non receivers get their heads chopped off, so me personally I will be waiting for the first sign.... of the SIGNING of the COVENANT. 3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
AC is dragon, seven heads are the seven world governments, the 7th being the 10 country nation, signing the Covenant, composed of ten horns... the AC being called the little horn that comes up after he destroys three horns (US, France and Britan)
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, (devils demons, fallen angels) and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born. (like the devil tried with Moses, ) 5 And she brought forth a man child, (JESUS) who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child (JESUS) was caught up unto God, and to his throne. ********************** end of questions, And so again, the same pattern applies as the devil tries to stop us as we flee...verse 6..... Moses parents had to flee, Jesus parents had to flee, and we have to flee from Jerusalem (Egypt, Sodom).. Moses had the first EXODUS, we have the greater 2nd EXODUS and even follow the same route, but backwards down the Kings Highway... Verses 6, 14 etc... in a timeline of 1260 days til we are caught up in the air. (the Rapture..) The Rapture happeneing at the end of the Great Tribulation. |
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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 5, 2017 17:11:39 GMT -6
David - it appears you are contradicting yourself. I stated that the Rev 12:1-2 Great Sign occurred on 9/23, which you appear to dismiss. The Great Sign happened and according to what you wrote, we are 73 days into Revelation 12. How can 9/23 not be an important date? Unfortunately I wont settle for your opinion on it unless its backed with substance from scripture. Mike, its your opinion... not mine, and your timeline, not mine....even though I haven't seen your timeline of events yet. As mentioned I can substantiate mine, and have done so.... but I like or prefer to put all events, times and verses together to better see if they all fit together cohesively, and in time. if you prefer your Great SIGN, interpretation, thats fine, I differ. I have Revelation 12, in the Great Tribulation period that follows the Covenant, Sacrificing Start, Nuclear War, AC entry, and ABOMINATION set up in the 3rd Temple.... IE Rev 12 is a long ways off IMO according to prophetic scriptures SEE graphics/// whoops have to put it on the next post |
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Post by davidjayjordan on Dec 5, 2017 17:20:00 GMT -6
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Post by thetimeoftheend on Dec 5, 2017 17:25:18 GMT -6
You said a whole lot there... So if I understand correctly you don't take the literal interpretation that they are Israelites from each of the 12 tribes, but rather a methaporical interpretation because they haven't earned that place? Would it be safe then to say you subscribe to replacement theology? No the literal translation is that we Christians are put in tribes....... and we are literally the chosen ones, as we have chosen the CHOSEN ONE...Jesus. As explained, Revelations deals with Christians and is a Christian book, and was written for Christians And did not change mid stream and substitute Jewish people into the end times, because they donot know the Lord... Therefore as mentioned we should reach them, even though the Pope said they should not be evangelized. Jacob was Israel, or became Israel once he learned not to trick, and not trust in bloodline blessings. IN Christianity, its always CHOICE and never automated blessings just because of parentage, bloodlines, etc.. *************** But if you believe the Jews are the chosen ones rather than Christians, thats your right ! If you think they will lead, even though unbelievers in the End Time, thats your right to your interpretation or replacement theory. Your choice, your discernment Actually, it literally says that they are Israelites. So to say that it is some subset of the church, which is not what is indicated in scripture would certainly be a metaphorical interpretation - not literal. |
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