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Post by yardstick on Oct 16, 2017 19:59:59 GMT -6
OK, it appears I had a math error. Or rather a perception error. When i read the original post, I read the time as 8pm. Not 8am. However, this does not change my position of checking, double checking and triple checking by corroboration, aka 'witnesses'.
A discrepancy, to me, is an indication, not that someone is wrong, but that there may be a disconnect between two perceptions that needs to be reconciled. No finger-pointing is needed to do that.
The "sign of the son of man", I have understood to be a special type of celestial conjunction. It has been recreated by stellarium (or any other planetarium software) showing a date of approximately 2BC, if memory serves (verifiable if someone wants to dig a little- it might have been autumn 3 BC).
My statement, "tradition that Jesus was 33 when he died, had a three year ministry, and priests in the temple cannot serve as such before they are 30)
" plus the "sign of the son of man" provides three different sources that support each other: Christian, Secular (stellarium) and Jewish. They support each other because when combined, they paint a very narrow window of time that Christ could have been wandering around Israel. There are other sources, these are just the ones I could recall.
If SK had a 'special revelation' it was for him alone. And judging by the way he presented the information, it was indeed! I do not doubt his sincerity. I simply require one or two witnesses of his experience. From his story there aren't any. That is why I say the revelation was for him. Not us.
I have not seen anyone mock jeremy. The Moderators are required to be skeptical of anything that appears to be a 'special revelation', especially when it is a first time, single, one time post! Their job is to protect us from people who would introduce bad doctrine, specifically that which is outside the ToS.
"...I'm defending God's word, which was revealed and confirmed with a double witness that would be impossible to create
...but ignoring revelation right before your eyes...I'm gonna find some people who believe God speaks today! ...
"
These statements all infer extra biblical revelation without the requisite comparison to that which has already revealed.
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Post by yardstick on Oct 16, 2017 20:01:06 GMT -6
as per cage - will we repent? Or will we insist on our superior knowledge? Will we just come back with an explanation of how we were right? Or will we actually humble ourselves and cry out to God? HWB, can you please explain where we were wrong? I am not very good at this stuff. |
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Post by yardstick on Oct 16, 2017 20:01:47 GMT -6
Awesome experience you have there cwood85 . As I read your post and you said wanted to hold/hug Jesus (paraphrasing) I thought "yeah I'll do that too, but I want to sit as His feet". I think I am a foot-sitter too. |
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Post by yardstick on Oct 16, 2017 20:03:41 GMT -6
@cage Well I had a really awesome reply about 3/4 of the way finished to this thread... and it disappeared 🙃 So hopefully I can remember what I had for the most part. I do not remember who in the thread, but someone said that Silent knight searched for Gods heart, not his mind. You hit the nail on the head! I went back through and read through the referenced thread again and the responses, slowly, so I could really try and understand.
Thank you yardstick for the informative post on personality types. That is very eye opening and helpful for everyone. I really encourage you to take the test if you have not. You seem to have some specialty in this area of study?
I took the test and posted the results as yardstick did as well. I wasn't surprised by the results because I am very intimate with my personality type. I will explain more below and how it relates to this post and the outcome of some of the responses. But I would like to clear up one thing first.
My Jesus is their Jesus. We are all after the same one, just different parts of him sometimes, which neither makes it wrong or a bad thing. We have what we call the BRAINS in the group. They like facts, numbers, codes, and math. They love finding it in the Bible and figuring it out. Chuck Missler imho is probably king of this field of Bible study. Then there are the HEARTS of the group. We see the emotion in scripture, get emotional with certain scriptures (I certainly do, especially parts of the gospel and crucified descriptions), relate to the characters from one degree or another and what they were going though.
I am after the Lords heart. I daydream about the rapture and after falling on my face and worshipping and thanking Him, there is seriously nothing more I want to do in the whole world than to run straight to Him and give Him a hug 💕 I am so envious when I read parts of the Bible and he walked and talked among us. To be right there, right with Him, talking and seeing Him, that is where my heart is. Reading about Moses and God being tabernacled right beside them, just pure envy and wanting. How lucky they where to be within His presence and they didn't even realize it.
For clarification, I am not saying anyone here does not want that, but those of us that run more on our emotions instead of logic, we understand it better. Which is why you relate more to certain ones of us here better than others. It's the same as me looking at a calculus equation, which is honestly just a bunch of Mumbo jumbo to me because I do not understand it, my brain does not compute or work that way. I barely skidded my way through trigonometry which ended math for me in high school lol. Don't remember a bit of it either 😜
My husband is a BRAIN. There have been many disagreements on how he can at times lack empathy and emotions. To me it hurts, and he seems cold. But once we have a sit down and rationally talk, he really isn't, nor is not trying to be. He is actually very sensitive, but is very good at calculating his emotions and responses to them. It took me years to learn this. It also took him years to learn that I am the complete opposite and will never think like he does. I am actually very ADHD and run at 1000 miles per hour almost entirely on emotion. Through therapy and learning how to recognize when My emotions are getting the better of me, the number thing I can do is slow down and pause. Pausing has helped me so much. Especially reading and remembering there isn't tone in written responses.
I hope this was helpful. So glad you have found faith in the Lord ❤️Well said. |
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Post by cwood85 on Oct 16, 2017 20:33:24 GMT -6
Well if anyone else can enjoy my post please do lol!
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Post by cwood85 on Oct 16, 2017 20:42:07 GMT -6
It was never my intent to belittle anyone, nor to be combative. I've been mistaken on many issues, and as I pray for wisdom and learn from others - (you all) I've had to revise and even throw out views I had held. Thanks yardstick for providing the clarity and explanations.
disciple4life you have spoken graciously to everyone, and it is something I greatly appreciate about you! You've not been combative or belittling. Quite the contrary.
@cage our forum is a place for all of us to share our theories, our knowledge, our ideas. Through discussion--sometimes with many different views from our members--we sharpen one another in our understanding of God's Word. Gentle disagreements among our members don't mean that we don't trust one or the other, or that we don't love one or the other. I am sorry you've been distressed. We have a fellowship here that is very close-knit. We love one another very much in Jesus' name. I just want to reassure you that discussion and gentle debate are not the same thing as disrespect, arrogance, mistrust. Discussion and gentle debate are the way we learn together.
I agree! Thank you guys for your post and I do not see or perceive any belittling or arrogance, at least not on my end. I am honestly really confused at some of the other responses and why and or how if it can even be called hostility even happened?!?! Each of us has our own personal walk with the Lord. We cannot expect everyone else to understand and relate to something that I or anyone else experienced by themselves. We also should not get upset if they do not understand, nor accuse anyone of being arrogant or belittling because they do not, and certainly ask them to repent for their wrong?!? Stop it with that, because that there my friend was out of line. |
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Post by Rick on Oct 17, 2017 0:51:41 GMT -6
To all watchmen and ladies,
I'm not exactly sure what provoked some of the emotions that have come out in this thread and I didn't see anyone being combative or dogmatic. I do hate to see anyone so troubled in their spirit that they feel compelled to leave the forum for what ever reason. I know we all have different personality types but we are all of one spirit, one body and should also be in one mind and will, the mind and will of God.
I enjoy so much coming here and sharing thoughts, the WORD, and most of all the fellowship. Anyway at this point if you don't mind, I would like to pray.
Lord, we come before you today as a disciple of Jesus. That through him we have chosen to walk in covenant with you, O Lord. That by faith in Jesus we submit ourselves to you O Lord, in unreserved obedience. That although the flesh is weak and we might sometimes falter, that our faith remain strong. That we continue to grow in your ways O Lord, and only in your ways.
Lord on this basis we rebuke and repent in the name of your son Jesus, of anything said or done by me or anyone else that would prevent us from receiving your blessings. If there are those who have been speaking or praying against us, or seeking harm or evil to us, or who have rejected us, we forgive them. And, having forgiven them, we bless them in Jesus name. Lord, we repent for all of our sins, those which we remember and those which we cannot. We ask that all unholy things be removed from us in the cleansing blood of Jesus. Lord we ask that you come upon this body right now in Jesus name, that you fill each and everyone one of us with your Holy Spirit in Jesus name, that it overflows from us and surrounds us, as we are gathered before you now. amen
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Post by disciple4life on Oct 17, 2017 1:16:38 GMT -6
as per cage - will we repent? Or will we insist on our superior knowledge? Will we just come back with an explanation of how we were right? Or will we actually humble ourselves and cry out to God? Hello HWB, Could you please clarify or explain what you mean.? Maybe you mean how I misspoke - Another member referred to another thread on a similar topic, and in my response, I mistakenly said it was a dream - actually, it was a "Conversation" between him and God, -and I corrected it. **Interesting that in the same thread being referenced - Not this one - the original poster/author said that God's voice was identical to his own. That's a strong signal that we should weigh and compare it to scripture.
Or maybe you meant how Yardstick misunderstood 8 am or 8 pm, and then corrected it?? Whatif has given some clarity on how gentle debate works. Whatif - "our forum is a place for all of us to share our theories, our knowledge, our ideas. Through discussion--sometimes with many different views from our members--we sharpen one another in our understanding of God's Word. Gentle disagreements among our members don't mean that we don't trust one or the other, or that we don't love one or the other. I am sorry you've been distressed. We have a fellowship here that is very close-knit. We love one another very much in Jesus' name. I just want to reassure you that discussion and gentle debate are not the same thing as disrespect, arrogance, mistrust. Discussion and gentle debate are the way we learn together."
Another thing - Someone mentioned that the third person in another thread didn't defend himself. He actually did respond several times and explained/ defended his position. That's how debate/ submitting hypotheses works. We present an idea, and then others look for holes in the logic, facts, or sometimes it's in the original language itself.
Rather than take things personally, and insult people, if there's a discrepancy between someone's position, and God's word, we should address that in love. *** We also should not assume that if a person doesn't respond or address the points - that it automatically means that the person is humble. Maybe they are, but maybe they're researching the other perspective, Maybe they can't offer a better explanation, Maybe they just have to work a double shift and then they have a wedding out of state. Everything isn't a spiritual motive
If someone tells me that they had a special revelation from God that in the flood of Noah, it actually rained 38 days, by Jewish **inclusive counting - [think like a car-towing company- any part of a day is considered a day ] 36 full days, and then a part of a day at the beginning and a part of a day at the end, then we need use solid Biblical principles. First and foremost, we pray and ask for the Holy Spirit to guide and direct us and give us wisdom. 1. We need to first just look to see what the text clearly says. If it's not Proverbs or Apocalyptic literature, -Revelation, or Prophets, then we shouldn't make something allegory.
This brings us back to the thread topic. Words have meanings, and it affects how we look at and discuss End Times. The way we knew with certainty that Jeremy Smith did not hear from God?? How did he have special 'secret knowledge' that all the scientists and seismologists missed? When God speaks - He doesn't give wrong data or information. ***This is the biggest way we knew Jeremy Smith was incorrect. Aside from the fact he was extremely dogmatic - no tone of "I think this is from God, but it could be something I ate" - He gave 7 years for the Tribulation on a Gregorian calendar. It didn't match either what is written in Daniel or Revelation. This is why Hermeneutics matters. This is why Gary the site Gary, and others have said that it matters when people take the phrase "No one knows the day or hour" and take it out of context. Solid Biblical interpretation shows that this is not even referring to the rapture. The context explicitly states this was after the Abomination of Desolation. This has nothing to do with KJS, or HomewardBound, or Whatif, or Yardstick or anyone having 'superior knowledge'. It is rightly dividing the word of truth.
Read more: unsealed.boards.net/thread/1078/death-christ-relates-eschatology?page=5#ixzz4vk1SYUMI |
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Post by mike on Oct 17, 2017 6:29:42 GMT -6
disciple4life not that I ignore or disagree with anything you said but I had to add to this This couldnt be more true! I can tell you first hand that there are times when I'm not sure how to respond but I want to respond. For example in a thread a few weeks back someone continuously came back at me with the same question. I think we were just missing what each other was trying to say, maybe. I became frustrated and rather than respond in anger/frustration, i e-mailed another member, who in turn provided a response that may have made better sense. So what I'm trying to say is even though I decided to stop responding had nothing to do with humility. It was more along the lines of "If I say something it's not going to be nice!" 
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Post by MikeTaft on Oct 17, 2017 7:00:52 GMT -6
disciple4life not that I ignore or disagree with anything you said but I had to add to this This couldnt be more true! I can tell you first hand that there are times when I'm not sure how to respond but I want to respond. For example in a thread a few weeks back someone continuously came back at me with the same question. I think we were just missing what each other was trying to say, maybe. I became frustrated and rather than respond in anger/frustration, i e-mailed another member, who in turn provided a response that may have made better sense. So what I'm trying to say is even though I decided to stop responding had nothing to do with humility. It was more along the lines of "If I say something it's not going to be nice!" That is just another fruit of the Spirit mike. It's self-control. Something we can all use a little more of, lol.  |
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Post by mike on Oct 17, 2017 7:55:38 GMT -6
Thanks MikeTaft, I really didn't even think of that! Wow! This is something God has been working on me for a long time then! And wow (again) cuz I gotta loooooong way to go |
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Post by homewardbound on Oct 17, 2017 8:56:47 GMT -6
A couple of you did specifically ask me to explain why I said this:
"as per cage - will we repent? Or will we insist on our superior knowledge? Will we just come back with an explanation of how we were right? Or will we actually humble ourselves and cry out to God?"
After prayerfully considering this, I believe I will not explain why I said this unless prompted by the moderators to do so. Each of us can look in our own hearts and hold ourselves accountable to God. It appears, based on some of the responses to Cage, that not everyone is willing to hold themselves accountable. I leave that between them and their Lord.
I will add, that making mistakes is not at all what I am talking about. I'm talking about bad behavior.
As a disconnected note: When we protect the guilty we do favors neither to the offended, nor the offender.
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Post by mike on Oct 17, 2017 9:10:43 GMT -6
I think this thread has run its course, has got way off topic and will no longer produce (good) fruit.
While it's sad to see folks leave over misunderstandings, continuing may do more harm than good, especially to those lurking.
Perhaps we can move on from this one, forgiving one another as imperfect vessels and bear fruit in another thread. Well that's where I'm headed.
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Post by homewardbound on Oct 17, 2017 9:13:04 GMT -6
as per cage - will we repent? Or will we insist on our superior knowledge? Will we just come back with an explanation of how we were right? Or will we actually humble ourselves and cry out to God?
Another thing - Someone mentioned that the third person in another thread didn't defend himself. He actually did respond several times and explained/ defended his position. That's how debate/ submitting hypotheses works. We present an idea, and then others look for holes in the logic, facts, or sometimes it's in the original language itself.
I am the one who said this. This statement, and the fact that you are calling this out, disciple4life, is indicative of something deeper. I urge you to ask the Lord to show you what I mean. The truth, should one care to know it, is: SK was immediately told he was wrong based on someone else's perception of scripture - (an example, by the way, of the error that Cage was trying to point out in this thread.) SK then demonstrated, effectively I might add, that the other person's perception was not the only way to see that scripture. SK did not defend the word he heard, he only presented a counter to the perception that was argued by his accuser SK's point was consistent - "I have nothing to be right or wrong about - I'm telling you what I experienced. " Since mistakes were made several times in the reading and telling of what SK wrote, I think we should be careful not to continue in that manner. |
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Post by homewardbound on Oct 17, 2017 9:19:58 GMT -6
as per cage - will we repent? Or will we insist on our superior knowledge? Will we just come back with an explanation of how we were right? Or will we actually humble ourselves and cry out to God?
*** We also should not assume that if a person doesn't respond or address the points - that it automatically means that the person is humble.
Maybe they are, but maybe they're researching the other perspective, Maybe they can't offer a better explanation, Maybe they just have to work a double shift and then they have a wedding out of state. Everything isn't a spiritual motive Why, disciple4life , would you feel the need to bring this up? |
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