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Post by kjs on Jul 18, 2017 11:04:06 GMT -6
I used to have a high respect for this guy. He is decent preacher, his sermons cover a lot of territory and almost every sermon ended with time to respond to the Gospel.
Some of that respect diminished when he came out Lambasting the Revelation 12 sign, calling it astrology and shouting No One Knows the day or hour!
I believe the rest of that respect vanished today, when I discovered he is peddling part one of a two book series (and DVD collection) titled “The Final Countdown”.
I did not watch the entire Sales Pitch – but what I did see has convinced me he is nothing but a hypocrite. Oh, He still stands by “No One knows the Day or Hour” … but he keeps parroting many others that based on the signs we know the Season.
I was like HELLO? Except for a few who actually give a more special time frame -- that is all anyone has been saying with this Revelation 12 sign --- WE KNOW THE SEASON!!!!
Based upon what I could stomach watching his peddling of the Final Countdown – it appears he has been working on this latest project for over a year – and he apparently wants to collect some MONEY based on it’s sales.
He lists a lot of the same “coincidences” that people have already discovered – saying look at these things – that shows we are at the DOOR – ready for The change!
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Post by Natalie on Jul 18, 2017 11:56:59 GMT -6
He did a sermon series "The Final Countdown" several years ago. I wonder if it's just a reworking of that series?
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Post by kjs on Jul 18, 2017 12:01:16 GMT -6
He did a sermon series "The Final Countdown" several years ago. I wonder if it's just a reworking of that series? It might be, because during the sales pitch -- he kept saying everything has been updated in the book, that might not be included within the dvd. |
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Post by whatif on Jul 18, 2017 22:48:50 GMT -6
I'm hoping maybe he will change his mind and take a closer look at the subject as the days get closer and closer to Jesus' return, kjs. Like you, I've also respected him as a preacher and Bible prophecy scholar, and I was saddened when I heard one of his recent programs in which he very severely spoke against Christians who are studying the Revelation 12 Sign. Sort of feels like getting slapped in the face... I'm going to have to turn the other cheek on this one and pray he'll really begin to investigate the sign...
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Post by socalexile on Jul 21, 2017 5:48:06 GMT -6
I recently had a major break, partially over this, with a pastor who I thought really had it together. He could not get past those who are using this event to set rapture dates, even though the sign is not dependent on the rapture at all in order to be genuine. He simply could not get that this sign has nothing to do with past hype and errors. Furthermore, he used such bad logic in his arguments against it that it made me wonder if his sermons were as well reasoned as I thought.
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Post by watchmanjim on Jul 21, 2017 22:20:42 GMT -6
That is a frightening thought, socal.
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Post by WarriorX on Jul 26, 2017 17:31:17 GMT -6
Like I've been saying lately. I have known and heard the term "immanency" for years from church about it meaning that He could come any day at any time. But after hearing and seeing about the Rev 12 alignment and then being re-presented fully with the Feast of Trumpets hypothesis/theory about the harpazo I cannot just leave it at the any time/day thought solely. I mean all seven feasts have been fulfilled once and the first four have been twice now. It makes no sense to say "yeah he can come any time" but then you have the unfulfilled Feast of Trumpets and a HUGE QUESTION remaining as to how it's going to be fulfilled. Like God was going to do all the big things on 1 through 4 but then totally leave #5 tossed up on the air, while doing 6 and 7 in an obvious way. That's just chaotic. Add to that all the obvious connections to what Jesus said to the Disciples about when that time would be. "Do not know the day or the hour" and "At the last trump" would have been known to them like the back of their hand. If it were any day at any time the ONLY way a trumpet of any kind would sound would be from Heaven only. So why would they say "at the LAST trump" meaning there's a sequence of trumps?
We can't get into arguments with those who want to say "any day at any time" because that does help people to get and stay ready. I also say that because death is still in the world that you have to be ready no matter what or when. But this seems and feels like a more pin-point and exact definition of the time period. Many still scream that it's date setting but it's not. The very Feast of Trumpets itself isn't even set on one particular date in time other than when the first light is seen after the New Moon, then it has to be confirmed by two witnesses. Only THEN is it made official.
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Post by whatif on Jul 26, 2017 17:34:07 GMT -6
Welcome to the forum, warriorx! I'm so happy to meet you!
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Post by watchmanjim on Jul 26, 2017 18:44:20 GMT -6
Welcome, WarriorX!
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Post by socalexile on Jul 26, 2017 19:31:57 GMT -6
Christ already fulfilled the fall feasts in type and shadow in His first coming On the fall feasts...yes Christ fulfilled them, but that doesn't mean there isn't another fulfillment as deemed by a timeless God. Christ is the Passover lamb prefigured and fulfilled per the Law, but He also died on the Passover. I think that's what many are saying in regards to the fall feasts. Christ fulfilled these in His role as Messiah already, but also may choose these feasts to fulfill His promises, which are as good as fulfilled already because God cannot fail a promise. Two things can be true at once, and we have to be careful with the language here, because it will send up red flags with some people.
It is similar to our salvation, we ARE saved at the moment of faith (because we are saved thru a promise, and God doesn't fail a promise), but we still have to "work out our salvation", I.e. live our lives and meet the point of our salvation at death or rapture. In the same way, the eternal Christ has always been the God of our Salvation, but He still came in the person of Christ, likely during Hanukkah of 2 BC, was likely born on the Day of Atonement in 3 BC, then was crucified and rose again during the spring feasts. Saying that the fall feasts have further prophetic significance is not necessarily saying that Christ didn't fulfill those feasts. However, we must be clear.
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Post by whatif on Jul 26, 2017 20:43:50 GMT -6
Did you mean the spring feasts, socalexile?
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Post by uscgvet on Jul 26, 2017 21:17:27 GMT -6
Christ already fulfilled the fall feasts in type and shadow in His first coming On the fall feasts...yes Christ fulfilled them, but that doesn't mean there isn't another fulfillment as deemed by a timeless God. Christ is the Passover lamb prefigured and fulfilled per the Law, but He also died on the Passover. I think that's what many are saying in regards to the fall feasts. Christ fulfilled these in His role as Messiah already, but also may choose these feasts to fulfill His promises, which are as good as fulfilled already because God cannot fail a promise. Two things can be true at once, and we have to be careful with the language here, because it will send up red flags with some people. It is similar to our salvation, we ARE saved at the moment of faith (because we are saved thru a promise, and God doesn't fail a promise), but we still have to "work out our salvation", I.e. live our lives and meet the point of our salvation at death or rapture. In the same way, the eternal Christ has always been the God of our Salvation, but He still came in the person of Christ, likely during Hanukkah of 2 BC, was likely born on the Day of Atonement in 3 BC, then was crucified and rose again during the spring feasts. Saying that the fall feasts have further prophetic significance is not necessarily saying that Christ didn't fulfill those feasts. However, we must be clear. I'm pretty convinced that the Wedding ceremony (also the Temple Dedication Ceremony) will occur just like the first two Temples. Isaiah 66 is about the Dedication Ceremony of the Future New Jerusalem that we will attend; the New Kingdom, with THE King! BOTH of the 1st and 2nd Temples had a dedication ceremony! On the Feast of Trumpets! This IMHO is why the Feast of Trumpets is Holy to the Lord! The Head: 1st Temple dedication ceremony, on the Feast of Trumpets, was with "elders", "heads", "fathers",the "King" (Solomon), and the Ark of the Covenant! [This is also representative of Revelations 4 in Heaven with the 24 elders] 1 Kings 8 And 2 Chronicles 5-7 The Body (you and me): 2nd Temple dedication ceremony, on the Feast of Trumpets, was with just the "children" ... gathered together... "as one man" (man child)! No elders, no heads, no fathers, no King, and no Ark of the Covenant... Just people! The Body! the "children" ... gathered together... "as one man" (man child)! [ representative of John "come up hither" in Rev4] Ezra 3 and Nehemiah Chapter 7 (the last verse) and Chapter 8 |
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Post by uscgvet on Jul 26, 2017 21:21:34 GMT -6
The 3rd Kingdom will be with The King of Kings, the 24 elders, the children gathered together as one man, and the New Covenant! And the Ceremony may very well be on The Feast of Trumpets, a Holy day to the Lord!
You guys need to understand... the Sept 23rd alignment isn't holy, the Feast is! That's why I'm not putting my faith in the alignment. The fact the alignment occurs on the Feast day is what gives it a WHOLE lot of credit worth our attention.
With that said, I still hold all of these teachers with high regards and will not judge them for not making this connection that we have with the alignment. That is not what I feel I should be doing. I've learned much from these people. I will take that with me to the Lord. Love your neighbor as yourself.
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Post by Gary on Jul 27, 2017 12:10:55 GMT -6
Great thoughts, uscgvet.
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Post by kjs on Jul 27, 2017 12:40:53 GMT -6
The 3rd Kingdom will be with The King of Kings, the 24 elders, the children gathered together as one man, and the New Covenant! And the Ceremony may very well be on The Feast of Trumpets, a Holy day to the Lord! You guys need to understand... the Sept 23rd alignment isn't holy, the Feast is! That's why I'm not putting my faith in the alignment. The fact the alignment occurs on the Feast day is what gives it a WHOLE lot of credit worth our attention. With that said, I still hold all of these teachers with high regards and will not judge them for not making this connection that we have with the alignment. That is not what I feel I should be doing. I've learned much from these people. I will take that with me to the Lord. Love your neighbor as yourself. The Feast of Trumpets is the 21st/22nd -- with the alignment occurring on the day after (23rd) (if both were to occur on the same day -- we would definitely have eureka moment. As stated before my "beef" with Pastor Crone -- has more to do with him selling the 1st book of a two book series -- just after he lambasted the Rev.12 sign like a week before. He then proceeds to GIVE the exact SAME proofs -- that has been shared here (and other sites) -- saying see we are in the Final Count Down -- buy my book and DVDs. |
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