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Post by boraddict on Aug 27, 2019 23:21:23 GMT -6
Okay. There is not much to this theory however there is supporting evidence in the following three items as well as a few others.
1) The Edras Eagle Prophesy in the Apocrypha that denotes the 6 short remaining feathers as presidents (my modified analysis). This summation shows that six presidents remain including Trump. 2) The two towers in Zechariah that also represent two rockets but for this computation these two represent the 9/11/2001 event as a beginning marker of time. 3) The 9/23/2017 FACT that in my opinion is undeniable; The Great Sign. It is from here that 24 years remain that bring us to 2041.
As many of us know, the number 4 is represented throughout scripture as a type of confirmation of things and times that pertain to Christ. For instance Noah and his 40 days of the flood that in my mind is 40 days of rain until the Ark was lifted from the earth. Another example is that Moses lead the children of Israel for 40 years in the wilderness. I hope you don't mind if I do not look up the scriptural references to this information since it is all common knowledge. A third example is that Christ was born at the end of the 4th thousand year period of time.
The reference to the number 4 in scripture is endless.
Therefore, the "critical number" is the number 4 and in our case we simply add one zero to make it 40. Thus, from the marker date of 9/11/2001 the ending year is 2041.
So the question becomes, how does the date of the Great Sign fit into our two dates of 9/11/2001 and 9/11/2041 (approximately)?
1) from 9/2001 to 9/2017 is 16 years 2) from 9/2017 to 9/2041 is 24 years
I do not find any significance to the 16 years but the 24 years is highlighted in The Book of Revelation as the 24 elders.
Although this might seem to be a stretch of the imagination; however, I have never been able to reconcile the 24 elders with anything except that fact that they are elders. For instance, the seven spirits/angels/churches are easy since the number 7 is made up of the numbers 4 and 3. As you may recall there are four angels that are distinctly separated from the three that remain (Rev. 8:13). So we have the never ending number 4 as angels at Rev. 7:1 and Rev. 9:14-15, and the biggy at Rev. 8:7-12. To further make the point, we have the seven seals as 1 through 4 with the four horsemen that clearly separates them from the remaining 3 at Rev. 6:9, 12, and 8:1. I hope that you can see that the numbers 4 and 3 are separate and distinct when considering the two groups that make up the whole of the number 7 in the Book of Revelation. There are further examples throughout the book.
So now consider the number 24. I have always thought that this number was an enigma. Yes it was two twelves or four sixes; but for what purpose. Additionally, the twelves by two makes no since that I could understand. There is one exception which is that the square of the number 12 is 144 and this makes 12,000 into 144,000. Yet, the 24 as two twelves does not jive and I can not find any other meaning for the number 24.
Thus, we have the 24 as two twelves that make 144 representing the 144,000 as the elders at Rev. 4:4, 11:16, 19:4, etc.; but, the primary application to this number is the timeline. I say this because The Book of Revelation is about the last days events and more specifically the last seven years; the tribulation, and as such we should consider the seven years as four years and three years. I guess that computation may not work with the given 3.5 years as outlined but it does make a point for the two aspects of the 7 years as the first half being subordinate to the second half. That is, the 4 is subordinate to the 3. That is, the 3 has a greater emphasis as shown in the angels and woes of Chapters 9-11.
In conclusion, I think there is a code in the Book of Revelation that pertains to the division of the 24 years that goes something like this:
1) pre-tribulation events in years 1 through 16 (2017 through 2033) 2) the tribulation in years 17 through 24 (2034 through 2041)
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Post by mike on Aug 28, 2019 6:06:45 GMT -6
boraddict - highly suspect. While a Hollywood script could be written from it, I do not consider this a valid view as it utilizes apocrypha as a basis for the time frame. While using outside sources to help understand Biblical concepts is often needed and helpful, basing your view of end times on a non-biblical scrip will likely lead to much confusion and squeezing things into a view that shouldnt be. Sorry sister, not on board with you on this chase.
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Post by venge on Aug 29, 2019 7:55:29 GMT -6
Honestly, I got confused by paragraph 3. What is this bora?
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Post by boraddict on Aug 29, 2019 19:23:45 GMT -6
Venge that is so funny. I confuse myself sometimes.
So the calculation goes:
1) 9/11/2001 is the starting date of the last 40 year generation
2) 9/11/2041 is the ending date of the last 40 year generation
3) 9/23/2017 (The Great Sign) occurred at the end of year 16; so, from the Great Sign there remain 24 years of the last 40 year generation.
4) The time line would be as follows:
a) the early years are from 9/11/2001 to 9/23/2017 and there are 16 of these years
b) the pre-tribulation years are from 9/23/2017 to 9/23/34 and there are 17 of these years
c) the tribulation years are from 9/23/2034 to 9/11/2041 and there are 7 of these years
5) since 2 years of the pre-tribulation years have passed (today is 8/29/2019), then 15 years remain until the beginning of the tribulation
The song that comes to mind is "Cry Me a River."
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Post by venge on Aug 30, 2019 8:34:45 GMT -6
Ok, so you’re tying a 40 yr judgment of time starting at 9/11 which really has nothing pertaining to prophecy. If your gonna do that, tie it to the creation of Israel or 70 years after we became a superpower or even from the end of ww2. 40 is always prophetic, but we don’t know the start so it’s impossible to find an answer.
A better thing, imo, is to figure out what was the 7th head of the beast. To understand a possible future role. My opinion: Nazi Germany allied with the Ottomans which was like Media-Persia. Massive land control, oppression and death, persecution of Jews, control of Israel, and Hitler as a Sennacherib, Nebuchadnezzar, Pharaoh, Antiochus Epiphanies...
Btw, not trying to shoot down what you’re looking at. I’m suggesting something looking for an event that more fits God’s desire then what happens to men.
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Post by boraddict on Aug 30, 2019 23:34:27 GMT -6
I know what you are saying Venge but I have given up on finding the 7th head. I think you have a good idea on the land grab angle however. With regard to the tribulation era, I would like things to mature more quickly. Nevertheless, we are two years past 9/23/17 with no viable explanation so far; at least none that I have seen. So what exactly is the sign for? Is it the Sign of the Savior? I doubt that. So we have the sign and the 70th year anniversary of Israel in the same 12 month period of time (9/23/17 & 5/14/18). As a matter of fact, these two events are representative of the fall and spring feasts. Not only that, but the first event coincides with the 1st rains of the season and the second event coincides with the second rains of the season (generally speaking). So the first event is in the fall, September, and the second event is the following spring at the month of May. The manner in which the ancient Jews counted the two periods of rain was first the fall rains and secondly the spring rains. As I recall, it had something to do with the planting of barley in the fall and so those rains were first upon the barley, and then for a good harvest the spring rains were second. Likewise, the September event was first and the May event was second. If you want supporting proof for the two periods of rain then let me know. Additionally, please consider that the fall event of Tabernacles is when Lord Jesus was born (my belief) and the spring event of Passover is when Lord Jesus was crucified. So likewise the fall event is first and the spring event is second. On a similar note I am convinced that the Savior started his ministry in the fall and then he ended his ministry in the spring although not in the same 12 month period of time. I do not know if this applies to the overall theory but the sign was first and the 70th year anniversary for Judah in Israel was second. Thus, the two rains upon the barley are represented. I guess the sign would then represent the planting and the second event would represent the harvest. Did you like "Cry Me a River"? Cry me a river because the Savior is not coming for 15 years.
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Post by venge on Aug 31, 2019 12:11:44 GMT -6
I know what you are saying Venge but I have given up on finding the 7th head. I think you have a good idea on the land grab angle however. With regard to the tribulation era, I would like things to mature more quickly. Nevertheless, we are two years past 9/23/17 with no viable explanation so far; at least none that I have seen. So what exactly is the sign for? Is it the Sign of the Savior? I doubt that. So we have the sign and the 70th year anniversary of Israel in the same 12 month period of time (9/23/17 & 5/14/18). As a matter of fact, these two events are representative of the fall and spring feasts. Not only that, but the first event coincides with the 1st rains of the season and the second event coincides with the second rains of the season (generally speaking). So the first event is in the fall, September, and the second event is the following spring at the month of May. The manner in which the ancient Jews counted the two periods of rain was first the fall rains and secondly the spring rains. As I recall, it had something to do with the planting of barley in the fall and so those rains were first upon the barley, and then for a good harvest the spring rains were second. Likewise, the September event was first and the May event was second. If you want supporting proof for the two periods of rain then let me know. Additionally, please consider that the fall event of Tabernacles is when Lord Jesus was born (my belief) and the spring event of Passover is when Lord Jesus was crucified. So likewise the fall event is first and the spring event is second. On a similar note I am convinced that the Savior started his ministry in the fall and then he ended his ministry in the spring although not in the same 12 month period of time. I do not know if this applies to the overall theory but the sign was first and the 70th year anniversary for Judah in Israel was second. Thus, the two rains upon the barley are represented. I guess the sign would then represent the planting and the second event would represent the harvest. Did you like "Cry Me a River"? Cry me a river because the Savior is not coming for 15 years. Never give up on things. Just put it away for alittle and come back to it later. With regards to the Rev 12 sign, I don't believe nor do I follow that as God's prophetic sign as in outer space on 9/23/17. So to answer the question: What exactly is it for and is it a sign of the Savior? I look at it as God's purposeful plan, from creation to present, to explain to us the message of his work and its plan. I believe the OT is clear when it demonstrates the Tabernacle as coming after, not before, Passover. Perhaps someone else would chime in on this?
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Post by barbiosheepgirl on Sept 1, 2019 9:06:53 GMT -6
boraddict , probably your best post that helps me understand your thinking! Amen on Jesus being born in the fall feast, in fact, I've been convinced that it was on FoT..It really kinda has to be, based on what Tabernacling means. venge , yes the OT SEEMS to have Tabernacles AFTER Passover. That is because we have a major direct and exact physical fulfillment of Jesus and the Passover feasts, that is easy to demonstrate. This seems to many to be the only feast He fulfilled so far, when He actually fulfilled all 3 at His 1st Coming. It was demonstrated to me that His birth fit the fall feasts physically, and He then WALKED (pentacost) and taught before His Passover Sacrifice. In a way, the fulfillments of the 3 major feasts happened in reverse involving the 1st Coming. Yet if you think about this fall feast first can be seen even broader when man was WITH GOD in the Garden. Man tabernacled with the Lord, then man followed a deception, which took his WALK apart from God. And exposing man to toil and suffer the weeds of his labor (Spring season is beginnings of barley/wheat production). Then God began the process of atonement with man. IN many ways, He does it with the FALL first, He called on Abram, as He walked with Abram, Abram then learned (walked) obedience to the Lord, then partook of a PASSOVER type, in sacrificing his son Isaac. Then received major blessing. I could go on, bringing Moses into the picture. There was a chosen born son, then called to deliver a people as Moses heard and obeyed the Lord, then the Passover lamb event leading to Promised Land Taberncales Pentacostal Walk Passover (Garden) (man following deception) ( skin covered)
(Abram called) (Abraham) (Lamb provided for Abraham) (Moses called) (Moses Obeying) (Moses & Passover/ provided covering from evil) (Jesus Born) (Jesus teaches) (Lamb provided by GOD, our covering for sin/evil)
How this plays out in the end, not sure, but this seems to be a pattern from the OT. But if you look at the examples above, one can say, from the CROSS, we have WALK, to achieve TABERNACLES. Yet is it SO?
We have the Sign in the Fall which is the only way the sign could happen is the Fall, and all the important elements of God were in this sign at one time. A Tabernacle. Now, look at us here and elsewhere, looking up, seeking to know more and more and praying about it, and studying His Word, seeking the clues. Even you venge , who has set the Sign to the side, no worries. He has a calling for you I have faith in that. You are demonatrating that we are in a "walk" first before the rapture. You are demonstrating a form of tribulation that is good for the church, and leads us to a stronger faith yet!
SO here is this:
(Sign of 9/23/17) (tribulation builds around us/faith grows) (First Fruits sealed) (First fruit are WITH JESUS) (priests unto the Lord minister) (Wheat harvest) (Body is assembled with Jesus) (battle of Armageddon) (Grapes of wrath now ready for Harvest)
This is how I see the Book of Revelation patterned. Based on how it all began with man in the Garden. It seems in reverse, but from the vantage point of time the First fruits are First, then those at His Coming (Body) then the End, when all are subjected under His FEET (like making wine with your feet). It ends up looking like Passover is first: First Fruits is a Passover event spring, Wheat is process event in the summer season, Wine is a Fall feast harvest event.
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Post by venge on Sept 1, 2019 12:31:34 GMT -6
boraddict , probably your best post that helps me understand your thinking! Amen on Jesus being born in the fall feast, in fact, I've been convinced that it was on FoT..It really kinda has to be, based on what Tabernacling means. venge , yes the OT SEEMS to have Tabernacles AFTER Passover. That is because we have a major direct and exact physical fulfillment of Jesus and the Passover feasts, that is easy to demonstrate. This seems to many to be the only feast He fulfilled so far, when He actually fulfilled all 3 at His 1st Coming. It was demonstrated to me that His birth fit the fall feasts physically, and He then WALKED (pentacost) and taught before His Passover Sacrifice. In a way, the fulfillments of the 3 major feasts happened in reverse involving the 1st Coming. Yet if you think about this fall feast first can be seen even broader when man was WITH GOD in the Garden. Man tabernacled with the Lord, then man followed a deception, which took his WALK apart from God. And exposing man to toil and suffer the weeds of his labor (Spring season is beginnings of barley/wheat production). Then God began the process of atonement with man. IN many ways, He does it with the FALL first, He called on Abram, as He walked with Abram, Abram then learned (walked) obedience to the Lord, then partook of a PASSOVER type, in sacrificing his son Isaac. Then received major blessing. I could go on, bringing Moses into the picture. There was a chosen born son, then called to deliver a people as Moses heard and obeyed the Lord, then the Passover lamb event leading to Promised Land Taberncales Pentacostal Walk Passover (Garden) (man following deception) ( skin covered)
(Abram called) (Abraham) (Lamb provided for Abraham) (Moses called) (Moses Obeying) (Moses & Passover/ provided covering from evil) (Jesus Born) (Jesus teaches) (Lamb provided by GOD, our covering for sin/evil)
How this plays out in the end, not sure, but this seems to be a pattern from the OT. But if you look at the examples above, one can say, from the CROSS, we have WALK, to achieve TABERNACLES. Yet is it SO?
We have the Sign in the Fall which is the only way the sign could happen is the Fall, and all the important elements of God were in this sign at one time. A Tabernacle. Now, look at us here and elsewhere, looking up, seeking to know more and more and praying about it, and studying His Word, seeking the clues. Even you venge , who has set the Sign to the side, no worries. He has a calling for you I have faith in that. You are demonatrating that we are in a "walk" first before the rapture. You are demonstrating a form of tribulation that is good for the church, and leads us to a stronger faith yet!
SO here is this:
(Sign of 9/23/17) (tribulation builds around us/faith grows) (First Fruits sealed) (First fruit are WITH JESUS) (priests unto the Lord minister) (Wheat harvest) (Body is assembled with Jesus) (battle of Armageddon) (Grapes of wrath now ready for Harvest)
This is how I see the Book of Revelation patterned. Based on how it all began with man in the Garden. It seems in reverse, but from the vantage point of time the First fruits are First, then those at His Coming (Body) then the End, when all are subjected under His FEET (like making wine with your feet). It ends up looking like Passover is first: First Fruits is a Passover event spring, Wheat is process event in the summer season, Wine is a Fall feast harvest event.
You know, what is interesting in all of that? In each case, Noah, Lot in Sodom, Rahab in Jericho, and Moses with the Jews all were there in tribulation and all were there IN the plagues that happened and all of them were saved the exact day it came upon the land. You have to wonder if God's people went through all that before they were saved, will it not happen like that again in the future? The parallel of the Exodus to our future time is uncanny. The Jews were there through the plagues but were prevented from enduring them cause of their faith. Yet, they witnessed it and were not removed from it. Only till the flood came when the waters of the sea rose up on either side and they passed on dry land were they finally free and their enemies destroyed. And it is interesting because as they forsake their Babylon wherein they lusted after what they left: the food, water, clothes etc and they begged God for meat and water in the wilderness. If Babylon is recognized, will you depart from it and go into the wilderness though you want easily attainable food and drink and clothing and the things you had, are you sufficient to say "I trust in the Lord" for all your needs? God wanted the Israelites to do that in the wilderness. When Mystery Babylon comes and he says come out of her my people, will you leave your house, your cars and clothing and flee with no money, no food or drink and just trusting in God 100% to take care of you? Because the other option is the mark. Which do people trust in? God to take care of ALL their needs, or the mark which will allow them to buy and sell putting that as their god in who they trust to take care of their needs. The compare and contrast of the 2 are amazing. PS. Sorry to veer off course Bora from the original thought.
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