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Post by gkp on Nov 28, 2017 14:15:37 GMT -6
I have been considering something lately and felt that now might be the time to offer to you. Not sure how to get it started but perhaps a story will help. Many years ago when our son was about six years old, he became very interested in how things around him worked. He constantly asked questions and ordinarily we found time to answer him. But inquiring minds want to know more than busy fathers can answer. He really wanted to learn about redwood trees. He checked a book out from the library that was all about redwood trees. He spent hours studying that book. And when the photos didn't yield all the secrets of the redwoods, he taught himself to read! That book opened a world of possibilities to him and he went on to discover the mystery of blue whales, bees, and a thousand other things. He never set out to learn to read - it was just a necessary tool to achieve his goal.
When I became a believer in the early seventies, I really had a hunger to know God. I bought all the Bibles and books my limited Army income would allow. And the Bible gave me many wonderful secrets. The Word of God has been such a great treasure and has drawn me ever closer to Him. About fifteen years ago I met a man who completely shook my little world of Bible study. He pointed out the truth that all English language translations are subject to the limitations of its translators. Even the best intentions can be off. He gave me a Greek/English interlinear and a list of books to buy. I ended up with greek lexicons, concordances, and text books on the language. This type of study was very hard for me but over many years I have become comfortable with the tools and and to a degree the language itself. It is work to get down to bedrock but boy, it is worth it! So many insights have come springing into the light that were buried under inappropriate English words! I never wanted to learn Greek (and Hebrew) but the desire to know God has kept me in the books. So I have learned some Greek by default rather than by design. Thanks, son, for teaching the old man new tactics.
I am writing this to fellow believers who are on the same quest I am on. Some of the writers that contribute to these discussions know far more than I do. And some of you readers are just beginning to seek and may be feeling a bit intimidated by such a group of saints. I know there are a lot more members than there are contributors! My hope is to create a thread where we can share the little treasures that spring forth from our feeble efforts to mine below the surface. And we can share the tools we use as well.
As I get older my eyes are not what they used to be. I can hardly read my Hebrew-english interlinear withthout a magnifying glass. And the book weighs a ton! I like to study while laying on the bed . I have almost been crushed to death several times when I get sleepy and the book lands on my face! And some times my reference material is in the other room and I don't make the effort to go get it. Especially if I have been pinned down by my interlinear ! So, I decided to try the Bible Hub as a way to have all the references at my fingertips. It is not the same as my well worn pages but I am doing my best to get used to it. I found some great little insights in Phillipians 2 today that I have never seen before. So I have become a believer in this new way to learn. I still have a lot of questions about using the tools though, and maybe someone out there can answer some questions.
So, all you seekers, feel free to join in and share your insights in our common quest to understand God's Word. I look forward to it!
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Post by Natalie on Nov 28, 2017 17:44:00 GMT -6
What a great idea for a post! Thank you.
I do not have many tools on hand. I will use Blue Letter Bible, and I have Warren Wiersbe's commentaries that I enjoy using. One of the things I did when I really began to read and study, was to buy a chronological Bible and read through that. It was so helpful with the Old Testament!
I have a couple of ideas of things I'd like to share later when I have a bit more time. Nothing overly deep or profound, but a couple of things that have stuck with me.
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Post by gkp on Nov 28, 2017 18:08:20 GMT -6
Thank you Natalie! I really look forward to hearing your ideas and those others might offer. Later this evening I'll see if I can find the time to share my little treasures from Phillipians from this morning's mining. One thought in closing: I have learned for me at least that God will show me a wonderful little thing. I then think about it, chew on it, let the Spirit examine my life, and find applications. There is great satisfaction in these little steps. I think it is the perfect way for me to learn. When the new thought becomes part of my life, God usually gives me something else to think about.
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Post by Natalie on Nov 28, 2017 19:14:12 GMT -6
There are two parables about a man selling all that he has in order to buy something else...
Matthew 13:44-46 "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure hidden in a field, which a man found and covered up. Then in his joy he goes and sells all that he has and buys that field. Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant in search of fine pearls, who, on finding one pearl of great value, went and sold all that he had and bought it."
Merge these together with John 3:16
For God (the man/merchant) so loved the world (the field, Israel, and the pearl, Gentiles) that He gave His only Son (sells all that He has) that whoever believes in Him (the treasure/pearl) should not perish but have eternal life (He bought the field and the pearl).
It's not the interpretation I was taught growing up, but I find it so rich and beautiful.
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Post by gkp on Nov 28, 2017 20:45:55 GMT -6
Hi again Natalie, your take on these verses is different than I have heard before. I agree that it is rich and beautiful. I will have to set my regular interpretation aside and try to see these verses from your angle. It will be a good exercise! There are two things in this passage that you may not have noticed. And this is where the Greek tools come into play.If you go to Bible Hub and use the interlinear you will notice in the literal English "heaven" is plural. In fact I believe that many if not all the uses of the term "kingdom of heaven" should be translated "kingdom of the heavens." Seems like maybe a small point but I believe it is a key to a bigger understanding if you think about it. Here's the second little surprise: those pearls spoken about - if you use the interlinear you will see that the word sort of translates into English as margaritas! I got a big kick out of that when it leaped out at me some time ago. Somehow I suspect the man was not looking for the ultimate drink!
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Post by barbiosheepgirl on Nov 28, 2017 21:47:42 GMT -6
Hi gkp! I really gained my confidence when I took a Precepts bible study (Kay Arthur) My mom (BSG-Mom) wouldn't leave me alone about going to one of these studies. I had been at BSF for several seasons prior. Doing precepts was super annoying to me to start. I called mom and complained royally at the job of having to read and reread verses over and over and over again (spoiled little Christian babe I was)... We no longer need to see Kay's videos as we have a fabulous instructor from church who can lead us girls without those dated (fashion & hair style) 80's videos of hers. The precept upon precept study got me to identify the who, what where when & how of Scripture. Finding the repeated words or phrases, the key words, who the audience is, all that, makes reading the Bible so much more understandable. And it helped lead my best friend back to Jesus, so I am truly thankful for that!
I use Bible Hub all the time to "cheat" my view points to back them up with greek or hebrew meanings...lol... so you are waaaaay more studied than you think! dont sell yourself short!
I really do like the NASV translation, next would be the NIV, but then the NKJV is where I go on Hub because some say that is the better translation. I think it was on one of silentknight's threads making a comment on the err of English translations, so where does one go to use a "good" English translation??
blessings!
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Post by gkp on Nov 28, 2017 23:25:08 GMT -6
Hi barbiosheepgirl !I am glad you found this thread. In the midst of intense news stories, stars to watch, as well as all the demands of our daily lives I wanted to start a place where we could all enjoy just the simple pleasure of sharing about how we seek to know God through His Word. I am not a structure sort of a person. The program you followed sounds like a wonderful path for many people. It would drive me nuts! Many years ago when I was a young believer I was associated with a group called the Navigators. They did a lot of discipling among young military guys like me. A group of us went to a conference with a lot of great teachers and a lot of classes to take. I signed up for one that seemed very useful. I think it was something like "how to have a quiet time." I took copious notes and felt it was a wonderful few hours invested. After class I was walking along and was crossing a bridge over a dry creek bed. My buddy Leon, also a young Christian, was walking toward me along the creek bed. When we met I asked him about what class he had taken. He told me he had played hooky and had taken a walk. He was just bubbly and beaming as he told me about the wonderful time he had just had with the Lord. I remember thinking he had squandered a rare opportunity to learn from a great teacher. Not much later I realized he had spent time with the Great Teacher.I have never forgotten my buddy Leon and how his simple testimony impacted my life. I am rambling a bit here and apologize. Not intending to put down structure or classes at all. I just know me and, thankfully, God does too. I think He tailors a unique growth program for each of us. We are so blessed to know Him! Edit I forgot about your English Bible question. I am not the go to person on that. I prefer the translations you mentioned to a lot of the newer easy reading ones because I think they are truer to the original languages. But I never forget they are each only an approximation of the original. I get really suspicious of attempts to make the Bible easy. It seems like an attempt to bring God's thoughts down to our level rather than expending the effort of "climbing the mountain" to meet Him on a high place. |
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Post by rt on Nov 29, 2017 15:25:49 GMT -6
There are two parables about a man selling all that he has in order to buy something else... Matthew 13:44-46 "The kingdom of heaven is like treasure hidden in a field, which a man found and covered up. Then in his joy he goes and sells all that he has and buys that field. Again, the kingdom of heaven is like a merchant in search of fine pearls, who, on finding one pearl of great value, went and sold all that he had and bought it." Merge these together with John 3:16 For God (the man/merchant) so loved the world (the field, Israel, and the pearl, Gentiles) that He gave His only Son (sells all that He has) that whoever believes in Him (the treasure/pearl) should not perish but have eternal life (He bought the field and the pearl). It's not the interpretation I was taught growing up, but I find it so rich and beautiful. This is how I have come to view these parables. I have had some heated discussion with those who see it differently, but to me this makes the most sense. Thanks for sharing! |
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Post by rt on Nov 29, 2017 15:28:18 GMT -6
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Post by Natalie on Nov 29, 2017 15:53:07 GMT -6
gkp - "Kingdom of the heavens" has a beautiful ring to it, after all, God is Lord of all the heavens.
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Post by gkp on Nov 29, 2017 17:49:09 GMT -6
Hi rt Thank you for the reference links! I looked at the Greek a minute ago and what's great is that it gives info about each word. That would prove very useful indeed. The Bible Hub reference I have been working with does not have this but it does give the pronunciation of the Greek word. For someone just getting used to these greek words, it is also a very useful tool. Thankfully it doesn't have to be either/or. It can be both! @natalie I am enjoying the way you think! Rather than commenting or speculating on the purpose of the plural, you notice the beautiful ring to it! I guess I felt that too but never put it into words. Thanks! Edit I was wrong about the Bible Hub interlinear. The info about the Greek word is at the lower level of the stack for each word. |
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Post by Natalie on Nov 29, 2017 19:52:34 GMT -6
Here's the other that has stuck with me...I'm pretty sure it came from Warren Wiersbe's commentary.
Psalm 22, the Good Shepherd lays down His life for His sheep
Psalm 23, He lives for the sheep and cares for them
Psalm 24, He returns in glory to reward sIs sheep for their service.
What I liked was that Wiersbe linked names of God with the descriptions in Psalm 23
"I shall not want" Jehovah-Jirah The Lord will provide (Gen 22:14)
"beside still waters" Jehovah-Shalom The Lord is our Peace (Judges 6:24
"He restores my soul" Jehovah-Rophe The Lord who heals (Ex 15:26)
"He leads me in paths of righteousness" Jehovah-Tsidkenu The Lord is our righteousness (Jer 33:16)
"You are with me" Jehovah-Shammah The Lord is there (Ez 48:35)
"In the Presence of my enemies" Jehovah-Nissi The Lord is our banner (Ex 17:15)
"You anoint my head with oil" Jehovah-M'Kaddesh The Lord who sanctifies (Lev 20:8)
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Post by Natalie on Nov 29, 2017 19:58:01 GMT -6
At some point I downloaded an "interlinear Scripture Analyzer". It looks like the one you linked only not as detailed, as it does not have Strong's numbers. I had forgotten that I had it, but I had found in useful in the past. |
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Post by gkp on Nov 29, 2017 22:10:07 GMT -6
Hi Natalie, my spell check always tries to outthink me and the @ sign followed by your name automatically reduces the upper case N and so the handy notification tool won't work. Wish I knew how to disable the thing! I appreciate your verses from those wonderful Psalms and the connection to some of the names of God. But beyond that, I appreciate you! Without knowing much about you as a person, I recognize that you are not a debater and you are not motivated to great levels of scholarship. You are one who simply delights in God Himself. You savor the breathtaking beauty of our Saviour and His love for each of us. I appreciate you for sharing these precious jewels with us. Have a wonderful evening!
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Post by Natalie on Nov 30, 2017 8:33:17 GMT -6
thank you gkp! I think you described me pretty well.  I also love to learn new things and try and benefit from those who know more than I do. my account name and my username are different that is why it doesn't tag me. try @ and wishing4. That should tag me. But I like the little "participated" button that shows new posts to the threads I have commented on. |
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I also love to learn new things and try and benefit from those who know more than I do.