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Post by Deleted on Jun 3, 2017 7:48:50 GMT -6
Total agreement KJs!!!
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Post by watchmanjim on Jun 3, 2017 17:08:17 GMT -6
Good point, kjs, and I agree completely.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2017 10:29:51 GMT -6
Yes BINGO, kjs. I've been thinking about this lately and you said exactly what I was thinking.
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Post by gregt on Jun 4, 2017 11:24:03 GMT -6
In John we learn the Father's will is for people to. "Believe in the finished work of Jesus Christ" Actually, there is only one answer to the question "What is the Father's will for people?" The answer to that question is found here: Matthew 17:5 While he yet spake, behold, a bright cloud overshadowed them: and behold a voice out of the cloud, which said, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased; hear ye him. This was one of 3 times the Bible records our Heavenly Father speaking audibly (the baptism of Jesus and John 12:28 are the other 2), and this is the only time of the 3 that a command to mankind was given. So when you see Jesus say this: Matthew 7:21 ¶Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. ...and you continue reading the passage: Matthew 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: 27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it. ...you know what the will of the Father is. Now this verse here: John 6:29 Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent. ...tells us what the work of God is.
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Post by kjs on Jun 4, 2017 11:53:34 GMT -6
28 what must we do to perform God's works.... 29. Jesus replied this is God's work - to believe in the one whom he sent....
Re-read John 6:28 - 40
40 this is my Father's will everyone who sees the son and believes in him will have eternal life.....
It is all about what Jesus Did Nothing about what I may or may not do.....
People claiming something different should examine what the have their faith in......
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Post by gregt on Jun 4, 2017 12:03:23 GMT -6
kjs, I have been examining what I believe for over two decades now. Why didn't you deal with the passages I put up?
I strongly suspect that a lot of dispensationalists are not going to make it because they fail to recognize the truth of these passages.
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Post by watchmanjim on Jun 4, 2017 12:53:00 GMT -6
If it were ALL about what Jesus did, then everyone would be saved, because His atonement was sufficient for all.
However, not all are saved, because there is at least one thing one must do to be saved. . . ". . . believe on the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved." Acts 16:31.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2017 13:46:38 GMT -6
Jesus died for all. That all "might"( made possible to ) be saved. Before the cross, you will notice that the message was "repent and be baptized". The nation of Israel was to do that so that they might be ready to receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit. I think it allowed them to keep them from being "blinded", spiritually. But look later in the jail scene, when the jailer asked Paul "what shall I do to be saved?" And the answer was BELIEVE.
When Israel, as a nation, did not become a light "unto the world", Jesus Sent his disciples to become a light unto the Jews, so. The 12 became a light to hopefully unblind Israel, and Paul was sent to do what Israel should have done but didn't/ now couldn't – go to the gentiles.
God gave us free will. Jesus died that we all might be saved, but we must exercise the free will he gave us and 'choose'( with that free will ) to BELIEVE Jesus Christ...., not believe IN Jesus Christ. Muslims believe IN Jesus, Jehovah's Witnesses believe IN Jesus, but they do not believe Jesus when he said he was the Son of God.
God knows who BELIEVES HIM. And those shall be raptured.
Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John were written to the Jews. Even when a gentle person came to see Jesus, he said he did not come for the gentiles but for the Jew only. That is why we see such a conflict of instructions. We need to hear the instructions about living as Christians from the resurrected Christ. The Gentiles will hear the message from Paul from books Romans through Hebrews, possibly Philemon....But notice the books after Philemon, start with lingo that points the instructions were to Jewsish believers. I think it would be very hard to be a messianic Jew and walk back into a predominantly hardheaded Jewish nation. And instruct them how to act/what to do amidst the tide. That is what I am seeing in those books and they are written by writers other than Paul.
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Post by gregt on Jun 4, 2017 14:02:11 GMT -6
Folks, I am not against disagreeing with believing in Jesus, I am pointing out that the people that Jesus says "I never knew you" are people who didn't listen to Him and didn't obey Him, with the emphasis on listening to Him. Why is it you guys don't want to acknowledge those passages?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2017 14:07:30 GMT -6
Gregt- I am not opposed to anything that you were saying and am not understanding what you mean, that we are not considering your passages? Please give me an example of the answer you're looking for and then I might be able to understand what I am missing?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2017 14:24:59 GMT -6
Gregt,
I am going to go out on a limb here. I live in a small town that is 50% Catholic. On any given day, I can ask a Catholic "are you a Christian?" question and they will tell me "no, I am a Catholic". I can also ask one "who saves you?", and they will tell me "Mary".
because I have family members and the denomination's presence in this town is so strong and public that we know much about the religion. They go to church and hear the words. And the religion concentrates greatly on works, so I believe both those categories of people hear the words, and do them...
I cannot say that I believe hearing and doing the works is enough, if you were one of those that believes that 'Mary' saves you.
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Post by gregt on Jun 4, 2017 16:47:50 GMT -6
Truthseeker, not sure what you are getting at because Catholics listen to the Magisterium of the RC church rather than Jesus. What I am getting is while Jesus did say "believe in me", He also said quite a few other things. Question: do you pray like Jesus said to pray?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 4, 2017 17:09:40 GMT -6
Are you referring to the Lord's Prayer? For Jesus instructed the disciples how to pray to the Father and he also had one of his own.
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Post by findtruth on Jun 4, 2017 17:16:45 GMT -6
There are many people who believe they are saved and unfortunately are not. Some believe that` to be a good person ' or, good works can save a person and are ways to get into the presence of God. This is far from the truth. It is all about a relationship and a heart belief in our Lord Jesus Christ that saves. I like pastor JDs take on salvation. He calls it the abcs of salvation. A- accept that you are a sinner and that one can not save oneself. ( accept the completed work of Christ on the cross as paid in full) B- believe in what Christ has done for you. He took our place on that cross and paid for every sin for all who believe. Also believe that God has raised Jesus from the dead. C- call on the name of the Lord and you will be saved. It is by the mouth that we openly confess and ask God to save us. The holy spirit will also draw and convict a person. Salvation is a free gift of God and whoever, accepts, believes and calls on the name of the Lord will be saved! God ,the Father will not turn away a willing heart who genuinely desires a relationship with our one and only Lord , Jesus Christ.
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Post by gregt on Jun 4, 2017 17:17:00 GMT -6
Yes the Lord's prayer found in Matthew 6.
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