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Post by venge on Nov 9, 2019 7:24:17 GMT -6
Could the sign be what happens on the earth rather then a change in a planet, moon etc? Couldn’t the sign be spiritual changes in mankind? Couldn’t the sign be the effective working of the gospel in a time it was void? Could the sign be exactly what it was like to be around Christ when he was alive when people were on fire for God and went out and told their neighbors knowing they may die- could you imagine the fire in ones spirit today? That would be a great sign to me that the kingdom of God is at hand. Not moon or Sun but right here in front of me, next to me and around the earth. Once dead believers now alive again.
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Post by disciple4life on Nov 9, 2019 8:29:46 GMT -6
This was a great message! A great reminder on why we should continue to encourage each other with the signs. I will post the Wednesday night study (11/6/2019) on the Metonic Cycle as soon as it goes up or feel free if you catch it before me. There is a slide that he shared with us that should really encourage us all. A side note yet related: I stumbled on some information that I thought was interesting. I am looking into the Qumran "Zadok" Calendars that were located among the Dead Sea Scrolls. There are about twenty different texts from Qumran which deal with a 364-day solar calendar. They are mainly very fragmentary, so the calendar is not completely understood. However, it is significantly different from the Babylonian lunar calendar which evolved into the 354-day Hebrew calendar as known today. The scrolls calendar divided the year into four quarters and recorded the feast days of the community. Feasts were fixed to the solar year and so occurred on different days from those indicated in the Babylonian-based calendar. Many of the texts are rosters of weekly shifts or courses of temple service for the twenty-four priestly families, known as Mishmarot. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qumran_calendrical_texts Thanks, bondservant , or stormyknight . Very interesting thread. I didn't have time to see the whole video, [It's almost an hour] but i'll come back to it for sure.
I love how, right at the beginning he actually used the title of a book, to explain how Satan always takes what God created and perverts it - He has no original material. How the Story begins with the virgin and end with the Lion of the tribe of Judah. The Gospel in the Stars . Wow.
For others not so familiar with the Hebrew calendar and leap months, there are 7 leap months every nineteen years. But at first, its really confusing, how to know when a leap month should be added.
Thus the Metonic cycle. For anyone else that's a visual learner, this really made it click, and it's also incredible how this fits perfectly on a music scale. I'd really love for someone else to explain that connection, because I'm sure that wasn't by coincidence.
[*I forgot to explain the numbers are years. Start at C on the left . Each 3 years is a whole step. Then a leap month. C to D =3 years. D to E - whole step, 3 years then 1 leap month. Half step - E to F is 2 years, then leap month.] It's interesting that since God's appointed times are based on a Lunar calendar, all the feasts are tied to full moons, new moons, or a short day count from these - 10 days/ 7 days.
This Metonic cycle and the leap extra leap month also corresponds precisely to the two different day counts by Daniel, - 1260 days = 3 1/2 years based on Hebrew lunar calendar, and the extra number of 1290 days is the extra leap month. Thus the two numbers. That's one way we can know that the time period is literal, not allegory or symbolic. Because we have three different passages / descriptions which interpret each other.
"Time, Times and half a time" is very enigmatic, but when we compare this with the 1260 day count, and the 42 months that the gentiles will trample the city, we can see they are a prefect match. It's also directly relevant because it's something that people can be watching for.
IMO there are several holes in the idea that it could be people's spiritual condition here on earth. - We can't see random spiritual changes in strangers, and it's also not something that we can know the time of in advance.
- It's also not something that would provoke the Jews to Jealousy. - It's also not in the sky.
Can't wait to see the end of this video, and the Study on the Metonic cycle stormyknight. He has some incredible insight.
Maranatha.
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Post by stormyknight on Nov 9, 2019 21:24:38 GMT -6
wow, disciple4life , I never knew that about the notes on the scale but it makes sense. Music is just like math in that it cannot be any different than it is. Meaning, what we call A is 440(also 110, 220,etc.) hertz. We gave it the label A, but the tone, the vibration of 440 cycles per second is harmonious to the other notes. But when you go up or down just a hair in frequency, it sounds off. So it stands to reason that when the angels sang for joy at seeing God's creation, their song was harmonious and not discordant. It blows my mind to see that the music scale is in harmony with the metonic cycle of the universe. There is so much knowledge we are not being taught. That means they were singing notes that were in harmony with the newly created sun and moon and earth, etc. They sang when time began. When we sing, we sing in time, 4/4 ,2/4, 3/4, etc. If we don't, it sounds wrong. So many little nuggets to find in God's creation, no?
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Post by disciple4life on Nov 10, 2019 20:54:41 GMT -6
wow, disciple4life , I never knew that about the notes on the scale but it makes sense. Music is just like math in that it cannot be any different than it is. Meaning, what we call A is 440(also 110, 220,etc.) hertz. We gave it the label A, but the tone, the vibration of 440 cycles per second is harmonious to the other notes. But when you go up or down just a hair in frequency, it sounds off. So it stands to reason that when the angels sang for joy at seeing God's creation, their song was harmonious and not discordant. It blows my mind to see that the music scale is in harmony with the metonic cycle of the universe. There is so much knowledge we are not being taught. That means they were singing notes that were in harmony with the newly created sun and moon and earth, etc. They sang when time began. When we sing, we sing in time, 4/4 ,2/4, 3/4, etc. If we don't, it sounds wrong. So many little nuggets to find in God's creation, no? Amazing stuff, stormyknight . I had never heard that about the frequency. I knew that there had to be some connection - the sheer odds of the Metonic cycle coincidentally working out to match up perfectly with whole and half steps on a scale was impossible.
The video was incredible. So much insight.
He really does seem to have prophetic giftings, and hearing the voice of the Holy Spirit.
I caught the part towards the end where he was clear that they are not setting a date, but he said explicitly that while they don't pretend to know which year, the rapture will be on some Feast of Trumpets. His actual words were Rosh Hashana, but many Christians don't realize that this is Yom Teruah. Feast of Trumpets. One and the same. He also mentioned the Last Trump, - the 100th blast of the trumpet on Yom Teruah.
The video was so encouraging and inspiring, and I can't wait to hear the next one - re the Metonic cycle - but I was disappointed to hear him say that the Revelation sign occurred on Feast of Trumpets, 2017. [Fot /Yom Teruah is Rosh Hashana - the start of the Jewish civil year. - The religious year is in the Spring, and is the First of Nisan.]
This was one of my criticisms 2 years ago, was that people were trying to connect this to Feast of Trumpets and several pastors and end-times speakers even made that claim, but it was false, and I said then, that to say it undermines those who say it. It's much better to just say it's close and leave it at that.
Christ fulfilled the first Spring feasts in perfect precision, and in perfect order, not a couple days before or after.
The Rev 12 sign was Sept 23, 2017.
A quick google search will show that Rosh Hashana was Wednesday evening, Sep 20 - Friday evening, Sept 22.
www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/09/19/when-rosh-hashanah-2017-and-what-jews-celebrating/680453001/
www.newsweek.com/when-does-rosh-hashanah-2017-start-and-end-dates-and-facts-about-jewish-668332
Other than this one thing, the information is astounding, and the details of the X and the city - Little Egypt etc, being 7 years from the last great solar eclipse, etc, etc, are just too many to be chance.
What a mighty God we serve. Alpha Omega watch. Awesome.
Maranatha,
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Post by bondservant on Nov 11, 2019 12:18:24 GMT -6
Could the sign be what happens on the earth rather then a change in a planet, moon etc? Could they be both?Couldn’t the sign be spiritual changes in mankind? Does everything that happen in the natural reflect what is going on in the spiritual?Couldn’t the sign be the effective working of the gospel in a time it was void? Could they not also reflect the past, present & future at the same time?Could the sign be exactly what it was like to be around Christ when he was alive when people were on fire for God and went out and told their neighbors knowing they may die- could you imagine the fire in ones spirit today? Do you mean like in the last days when:
And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:
21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.That would be a great sign to me that the kingdom of God is at hand. Not moon or Sun but right here in front of me, next to me and around the earth. Once dead believers now alive again. I agree.. those that seek signs to prove what that Jesus is who He said He is will only be given the sign of Jonah.
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Post by bondservant on Nov 11, 2019 12:20:09 GMT -6
For others not so familiar with the Hebrew calendar and leap months, there are 7 leap months every nineteen years. But at first, its really confusing, how to know when a leap month should be added. Thus the Metonic cycle. For anyone else that's a visual learner, this really made it click, and it's also incredible how this fits perfectly on a music scale. I'd really love for someone else to explain that connection, because I'm sure that wasn't by coincidence. Metonic cycle.gif Metonic cycle.gif [*I forgot to explain the numbers are years. Start at C on the left . Each 3 years is a whole step. Then a leap month. C to D =3 years. D to E - whole step, 3 years then 1 leap month. Half step - E to F is 2 years, then leap month.] It's interesting that since God's appointed times are based on a Lunar calendar, all the feasts are tied to full moons, new moons, or a short day count from these - 10 days/ 7 days. I have been working on a study for this and I believe you just gave me a piece of the puzzle. I am so excited!!
*Edited to try to add the pictures
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Post by venge on Nov 12, 2019 5:19:46 GMT -6
Could the sign be what happens on the earth rather then a change in a planet, moon etc? Could they be both? Is there scripture by Paul to look after a sign in the sky? Couldn’t the sign be spiritual changes in mankind? Does everything that happen in the natural reflect what is going on in the spiritual? I think Christ teaches us spiritual matters to prepare us because we are weak. Couldn’t the sign be the effective working of the gospel in a time it was void? Could they not also reflect the past, present & future at the same time? Perhaps. Could the sign be exactly what it was like to be around Christ when he was alive when people were on fire for God and went out and told their neighbors knowing they may die- could you imagine the fire in ones spirit today? Do you mean like in the last days when:
And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy:
19 And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke:
20 The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and notable day of the Lord come:
21 And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved. That’s not what I mean. That would be a great sign to me that the kingdom of God is at hand. Not moon or Sun but right here in front of me, next to me and around the earth. Once dead believers now alive again. I agree.. those that seek signs to prove what that Jesus is who He said He is will only be given the sign of Jonah.
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Post by bondservant on Nov 12, 2019 12:53:00 GMT -6
1 Corinthians 15:41-42 was the only place I found where Paul mentions all three but this (1 Corinthians 3:4-10 ) came to mind when you mentioned Paul as I would ask the question: Is there scripture of Jesus saying to look after a sign in the sky? 1 Corinthians 15:41-42 There are heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the glory of the heavenly is of one kind, and the glory of the earthly is of another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for star differs from star in glory. 42 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable. 43 It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 1 Corinthians 3:4-10 4 For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not being merely human? 5 What then is Apollos? What is Paul? Servants through whom you believed, as the Lord assigned to each. 6 I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the growth. 7 So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God who gives the growth. 8 He who plants and he who waters are one, and each will receive his wages according to his labor. 9 For we are God's fellow workers. You are God's field, God's building. 10 According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and someone else is building upon it. Let each one take care how he builds upon it. 11 For no one can lay a foundation other than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. I 100% agree with the statement that barbiosheepgirl made: "BUT I am not here to change your mind. For some reason the Lord has you in a wall against Gen 1:14.. I have faith that there is a reason for this. Perhaps to keep some of us grounded from the idols of star search"
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Post by venge on Nov 12, 2019 13:59:29 GMT -6
1 Corinthians 15:41-42 was the only place I found where Paul mentions all three but this (1 Corinthians 3:4-10 ) came to mind when you mentioned Paul as I would ask the question: Is there scripture of Jesus saying to look after a sign in the sky? 1 Corinthians 15:41-42 There are heavenly bodies and earthly bodies, but the glory of the heavenly is of one kind, and the glory of the earthly is of another. 41 There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for star differs from star in glory. 42 So is it with the resurrection of the dead. What is sown is perishable; what is raised is imperishable. 43 It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised in power. 44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body. 1 Corinthians 3:4-10 4 For when one says, “I follow Paul,” and another, “I follow Apollos,” are you not being merely human? 5 What then is Apollos? What is Paul? Servants through whom you believed, as the Lord assigned to each. 6 I planted, Apollos watered, but God gave the growth. 7 So neither he who plants nor he who waters is anything, but only God who gives the growth. 8 He who plants and he who waters are one, and each will receive his wages according to his labor. 9 For we are God's fellow workers. You are God's field, God's building. 10 According to the grace of God given to me, like a skilled master builder I laid a foundation, and someone else is building upon it. Let each one take care how he builds upon it. 11 For no one can lay a foundation other than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. I 100% agree with the statement that barbiosheepgirl made: "BUT I am not here to change your mind. For some reason the Lord has you in a wall against Gen 1:14.. I have faith that there is a reason for this. Perhaps to keep some of us grounded from the idols of star search"bondservant, The scripture you provided does not ask us to look for a sign in the sky. The first one posted relates luminaries and their roles. It was to explain the following verses about our earthly and spiritual bodies. It was not speaking of signs. Imo, The second scripture explained the process of man’s role and God’s in a man’s life in sanctification and soul winning. Perhaps I’m not understanding how you saw these. I’m not challenging you to find something to prove you wrong. Perhaps that was not made clear. I’m not familiar with Paul saying or eluding to Christ, that specifies a need or commandment that a Christian should look to the sky (planets) for a sign and that fundamental need or command was practiced by the original church documented by Eusebius, Paul, Peter, John, Polycarp or many others. If it exists in the context I wrote, can you provide adequate scripture or testimony from early church father manuscripts?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 12, 2019 14:19:46 GMT -6
"those that seek signs to prove what that Jesus is who He said He is will only be given the sign of Jonah"
Context matters. Audience matters. Who was it, Jesus spoke to? The pharisees and the scribes of his own people, the Jews. What was the context of this? The guys wanted a sign from Jesus. And Jesus pointed them to the sign of his death and his time in the grave.
I dont think, that this quote is applicable to the discussion of the celestial and astronomical signs. I would call this eisegesis... Just my 2 cent.
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Post by Natalie on Nov 12, 2019 14:31:36 GMT -6
I wouldn't say He commands us to look, but He says there will be signs in the sun, moon, and stars. We are to watch for His coming. Could some of that watching include noticing signs in the sun, moon, and stars? Signs we can see because modern technology makes it possible?
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Post by venge on Nov 12, 2019 15:25:35 GMT -6
I wouldn't say He commands us to look, but He says there will be signs in the sun, moon, and stars. We are to watch for His coming. Could some of that watching include noticing signs in the sun, moon, and stars? Signs we can see because modern technology makes it possible? Were the disciples or the early church taught to look at the sun, moon, equinoxes etc where we find scripture of them telling us to do so?
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Post by mike on Nov 12, 2019 18:32:35 GMT -6
venge - of course they were! They studied the scripture and Genesis clearly tells us in 1:14 14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years:
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Post by yardstick on Nov 13, 2019 0:08:32 GMT -6
wow, disciple4life , I never knew that about the notes on the scale but it makes sense. Music is just like math in that it cannot be any different than it is. Meaning, what we call A is 440(also 110, 220,etc.) hertz. We gave it the label A, but the tone, the vibration of 440 cycles per second is harmonious to the other notes. But when you go up or down just a hair in frequency, it sounds off. So it stands to reason that when the angels sang for joy at seeing God's creation, their song was harmonious and not discordant. It blows my mind to see that the music scale is in harmony with the metonic cycle of the universe. There is so much knowledge we are not being taught. That means they were singing notes that were in harmony with the newly created sun and moon and earth, etc. They sang when time began. When we sing, we sing in time, 4/4 ,2/4, 3/4, etc. If we don't, it sounds wrong. So many little nuggets to find in God's creation, no? Not to mention the Circle of Fifths and how it fits with the Fibonacci Sequence.
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Post by yardstick on Nov 13, 2019 0:13:14 GMT -6
venge - of course they were! They studied the scripture and Genesis clearly tells us in 1:14 14 And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years: I think the key here is that they were looking at the stars, sun, moon, et c; but where they got in trouble (gnostics?) is when they did so in lieu of the scriptures, or without checking against the scriptures. These situations are where people get into trouble with astrology, rather than astronomy.
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