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Post by kjs on Apr 15, 2019 8:41:21 GMT -6
After seeing this article posted in the shout box....
I decided to create a little thread to discuss this "habit" of people to "worship" man-made items rather than worship God The Father and Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit.
And if you do not think these people are worshiping "stairs" -- take another look at that photograph.
First there is no "proof" that Jesus ever walked on those stairs. Second there is no proof that Jesus' Blood splattered on those stairs.
But even; IF one could prove without a shadow of a doubt the above two "beliefs" -- You still end up with a "SO WHAT"
The Death, Burial, and Resurrection of Jesus Christ is what is important -- not some stairs that He might have climbed.........
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Post by mike on Apr 15, 2019 9:52:01 GMT -6
2 Kings 19:18 And have cast their gods into the fire: for they [were] no gods, but the work of men's hands, wood and stone: therefore they have destroyed them.
Isaiah 44:9 They that make a graven image are all of them vanity; and their delectable things shall not profit; and they are their own witnesses; they see not, nor know; that they may be ashamed.
Psalm 97:7 Confounded be all they that serve graven images, that boast themselves of idols: worship him, all ye gods.
Psalm 115:4 Their idols [are] silver and gold, the work of men's hands. 5 They have mouths, but they speak not: eyes have they, but they see not: 6 They have ears, but they hear not: noses have they, but they smell not: 7 They have hands, but they handle not: feet have they, but they walk not: neither speak they through their throat. 8 They that make them are like unto them; [so is] every one that trusteth in them. 9 O Israel, trust thou in the LORD: he [is] their help and their shield.
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Post by stormyknight on Apr 15, 2019 11:24:38 GMT -6
You know, after learning about the Rev. 12 sign and first encountering Unsealed.org, and pretty much having a new awakening to my spirit, Thank you, Heavenly Father!!, I look back at my past once in awhile and think about the times where He stirred my spirit. One event that particularly comes to mind after seeing your post, kjs , is a certain catholic "holy day", I don't remember the name of it, when I was an altar boy, where everyone would line up and come up and kiss the feet of the figure of Jesus on the cross. My thought was 'ewwww, i'm not touching that with my lips" and I never would, I would go through the motions, but never touch. I thought 'why would God want us to do that? That's a good way to spread sicknesses?" Idk, I was a simple minded kid, but thought God would be more logical/practical than mystical. Anyway, that was just our local congregation. These are 'pilgrims' from around the world kissing little crosses on the stairs. I'm not a germaphobic, but it's really a wonder we haven't wiped ourselves out just from disease spreading practices like this. sorry, rant over.
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Post by barbiosheepgirl on Apr 15, 2019 14:44:42 GMT -6
very earie KJS that you make this comment and Notre Dame is burning.
As to your comment, AMEN from the rooftops!
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Post by canada on Apr 16, 2019 15:36:32 GMT -6
Yes ... Notre Dame (Our Mother) is a graven image and much within it. The destruction of Vatican City (Mystery Babylon) is in the not too distant future.
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Post by cwood85 on Apr 16, 2019 21:34:07 GMT -6
Yes ... Notre Dame (Our Mother) is a graven image and much within it. The destruction of Vatican City (Mystery Babylon) is in the not too distant future. The Vatican is not Mystery Babylon. Rome has nothing to do with Babylon. Babylon is Babylon. The only thing it can be associated with is literal Babylon, confusion, or false religion. Catholicism is NOT false religion. Revelation 17:5 should be understood like this, "Islam, Babylon the Great, the mother of jihadist and abominations of the earth." I beg to differ on the Catholicism not being false. Now please understand that I differentiate between someone who is catholic and believes the gospel verses the catholic religion. The catholic religion believes their priest and popes are so holy that God submits to them and they are appointed by Christ. Also that Mary intercedes for us and her statues are worshipped worldwide. I do believe that the Bible more than once states Christ is the one who intercedes on our behalf. Babylon was the world hub of any religion one could imagine, as long as at the appropriate times, the current ruler was worshipped when commanded. Any statue or idol that was deemed as a god was worshipped. Mystery Babylon is any and all “religion and false systems” in the sense that someone has to do a work to obtain and keep whatever form of salvation or god they believe in. In terms of Christianity and works, some teach that by a persons good works as the only to obtain and keep their salvation. Apparently not telling a fib your entire life completes what Christ accomplished on the cross? That is false religion when someone elevates their own works and faith to complete what our savior already finished. Buddha’s believe all their actions produce whatever happens to them by means of good or bad karma. A Buddhist will not stop and help and person who is in need because they believe that persons current state is a result of their karma and that bad karma can rub off on them. It is not solely Islam that is false religion not entirely what Mystery Babylon is.
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Post by venge on Apr 17, 2019 6:23:32 GMT -6
Yes ... Notre Dame (Our Mother) is a graven image and much within it. The destruction of Vatican City (Mystery Babylon) is in the not too distant future. Mystery Babylon is not identified as Vatican City in scripture. It is only an opinion. The same as some believe it is Rome because it sits on 7 mountains though we know it isn’t literal mountains a women sits on. Some think Jerusalem, some Mecca and some America though it’s stated as a city, not a nation entirely. All examples of opinions. The Vatican is hardly the trade capital of the world where we’d cry because its destroyed and now we cannot buy things our souls lust after like TVs, iPhones, computers, technology, produce, lumber, fine gem stones etc... That poses a problem.
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Post by stormyknight on Apr 17, 2019 9:23:14 GMT -6
time and again we try to interpret scripture from the description given when there isn't an outright identification. Some descriptions are not that important, just the person speaking's impression, such as: "On the Lord’s day I was in the Spirit, and I heard behind me a loud voice like a trumpet," Rev. 1:10My father in law had a voice like a chainsaw.
What I'm getting at is that what the person sees, they describe as best they can in reference to what they know and in John's description in Revelation of the woman riding the scarlet beast, who he names "Mystery, Babylon the Great", as "dressed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls."Rev. 17:4. Now, I don't know about anyone else, but from my experience, that, alone, is an apt description of the catholic church in full regalia. There are other similarities as well.
As for catholicism being false christianity, if I were the devil, as Paul Harvey once read a poem titled the same*, I would want to make a copy of the real thing, but pervert it just enough to keep people believing it was right. The gospel of Jesus Christ is so simple a child can understand it, so if things begin to get complicated, red flags start to go up for me.
*
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Post by venge on Apr 17, 2019 12:53:46 GMT -6
time and again we try to interpret scripture from the description given when there isn't an outright identification. Some descriptions are not that important, just the person speaking's impression, such as: "On the Lord’s day I was in the Spirit, and I heard behind me a loud voice like a trumpet," Rev. 1:10My father in law had a voice like a chainsaw.
What I'm getting at is that what the person sees, they describe as best they can in reference to what they know and in John's description in Revelation of the woman riding the scarlet beast, who he names "Mystery, Babylon the Great", as "dressed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls."Rev. 17:4. Now, I don't know about anyone else, but from my experience, that, alone, is an apt description of the catholic church in full regalia. There are other similarities as well.
As for catholicism being false christianity, if I were the devil, as Paul Harvey once read a poem titled the same*, I would want to make a copy of the real thing, but pervert it just enough to keep people believing it was right. The gospel of Jesus Christ is so simple a child can understand it, so if things begin to get complicated, red flags start to go up for me.
*
Stormyknight, I agree John saw what was given to him and he identified it the best way he could with the understand he had around 93-98 AD. What I am saying is that certain things still apply. Mystery Babylon is shown to be wealthy. Wealth is a sign of great prosperity. Much like the USA, the UAE, Countries in Europe...etc...I would not call Babylon in todays world much of Africa, Asia or other parts. Perhaps Singapore...but that's it for that part. But we are given all the different things she trades in. We are told that the ships's captains would be upset. It is referenced because they were traders. Today we also have ships that move cargo, and trains and planes. But the real point is economic trade. The stock market. When a Capitol city like Old Babylon is crushed and that city was the main city of many cities of that kingdom, their stock market crashed. It would cause other nations that trade with Babylon to cause theirs to crash too. People would worry about the state of the world, economics, protectionisms, war etc....And if Babylon was a world power, and it was just destroyed...what does the rest of the world think will happen to them? How about get in line and sit down or be put in the fire? Certain cities that appear to be so because they fit the status quo in some regards don't hold up in other regards. Mystery Babylon is a city that does enormous trade with the world. Its Leaders do business ties with this city economically. This follows why Tyre was destroyed as God said it was because of their traffic, ie. trade with other nations. They made themselves rich and boasted of themselves. That doesn't describe the Vatican. The Vatican or Rome. Neither is a major trader in huge business deals as described by the angel of the harlot. Neither resembles old Babylon. Maybe in the future that can change, but as of today and yesterday, that is not the case.
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Post by stormyknight on Apr 17, 2019 14:18:40 GMT -6
venge , I will be the first to admit that I don't know for sure who "Mystery, Babylon the Great" is, but I do believe the catholic church, not just The Vatican(it's a symbol for the whole), the catholic church worldwide is a very good candidate for that 'woman riding the scarlet beast'. I'm going to assume that what you are referring to is when Jesus Christ destroys Babylon, correct? One must remember all hell, or Heaven rather, is breaking loose here on earth. For the catholic church to be destroyed in one hour would definitely strike fear in the hearts of traders worldwide. The catholic church is not only one of the richest 'entities' on earth, it also trades in most all of the goods listed in Rev. 18:12-13: "cargo of gold, silver, precious stones, and pearls; of fine linen, purple, silk, and scarlet; of all kinds of citron wood and every article of ivory and precious wood, of bronze, iron, and marble; of cinnamon, spice, incense, myrrh, and frankincense; of wine, olive oil, fine flour, and wheat; of cattle, sheep, horses, and chariots; of slaves and souls of men:"It takes a lot of material to keep the seminaries and convents and cathedrals, as well as the outlying diocese, operating. And don't kid yourself(no offense), they are not going to settle for anything but the best! The best linen for their altars, the best scarlet and purple for their robes, the best food and wine(have you ever tasted the wine used for a catholic mass? it's some pretty good wine!), you name it. And the catholic church trades all over the world and has for centuries. The recent catastrophe in Paris will be a good test for this, you watch and see. They will be ordering in the best materials to rebuild "our lady".
That said, I don't see any country or confederate even coming close to outfitting themselves in the manner that the catholic church does. I could be wrong, I might be wrong. But it doesn't matter. I will gladly change my mind with convincing evidence otherwise.
Cheers, my friend.
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Post by venge on Apr 17, 2019 14:29:57 GMT -6
venge , I will be the first to admit that I don't know for sure who "Mystery, Babylon the Great" is, but I do believe the catholic church, not just The Vatican(it's a symbol for the whole), the catholic church worldwide is a very good candidate for that 'woman riding the scarlet beast'. I'm going to assume that what you are referring to is when Jesus Christ destroys Babylon, correct? One must remember all hell, or Heaven rather, is breaking loose here on earth. For the catholic church to be destroyed in one hour would definitely strike fear in the hearts of traders worldwide. The catholic church is not only one of the richest 'entities' on earth, it also trades in most all of the goods listed in Rev. 18:12-13: "cargo of gold, silver, precious stones, and pearls; of fine linen, purple, silk, and scarlet; of all kinds of citron wood and every article of ivory and precious wood, of bronze, iron, and marble; of cinnamon, spice, incense, myrrh, and frankincense; of wine, olive oil, fine flour, and wheat; of cattle, sheep, horses, and chariots; of slaves and souls of men:"It takes a lot of material to keep the seminaries and convents and cathedrals, as well as the outlying diocese, operating. And don't kid yourself(no offense), they are not going to settle for anything but the best! The best linen for their altars, the best scarlet and purple for their robes, the best food and wine(have you ever tasted the wine used for a catholic mass? it's some pretty good wine!), you name it. And the catholic church trades all over the world and has for centuries. The recent catastrophe in Paris will be a good test for this, you watch and see. They will be ordering in the best materials to rebuild "our lady".
That said, I don't see any country or confederate even coming close to outfitting themselves in the manner that the catholic church does. I could be wrong, I might be wrong. But it doesn't matter. I will gladly change my mind with convincing evidence otherwise.
Cheers, my friend. Vatican itself is worth about 30 Billion US. Church is Jesus Christ and Latter day saints at 35 billion. Harvard U at 37.6 billion. All of this is peanuts. Look at these net worth: Saudi Aramco at 1,300 billion Apple 910 billion General Electric 439 billion or we can look at HEREBabylon was the capitol of the kingdom. The kingdom itself was infected because of the policies that the leadership of the capitol did. I am only saying we should be looking at kingdoms today (nations) and their capitols.
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Post by mike on Apr 17, 2019 14:30:55 GMT -6
just reading the last few posts...taking into consideration a few other discussions on the site the last couple days/weeks, please remember this is a discussion not who's right or wrong. I am not saying anyone (Venge or Stormy) is doing that, just want to remind. I feel like the enemy is creeping into to divide and WE cannot allow that to happen between brothers/sisters. Discuss and sharpen each other
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Post by venge on Apr 17, 2019 14:39:15 GMT -6
just reading the last few posts...taking into consideration a few other discussions on the site the last couple days/weeks, please remember this is a discussion not who's right or wrong. I am not saying anyone (Venge or Stormy) is doing that, just want to remind. I feel like the enemy is creeping into to divide and WE cannot allow that to happen between brothers/sisters. Discuss and sharpen each other I don't think so Mike. Stormy had stated: and I don't know what city Mystery babylon is either. I have multiple opinions on it. What I was pointing out was that there is a lot against the Vatican position because its not a kingdom like France, the UK, USA, UAE etc..it doesn't hold business like those countries, its not economy driven which would effect other nations like many countries are today. This is how you discuss things. Discussions are not always pretty but they are useful in dividing truth and gaining wisdom.
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Post by stormyknight on Apr 17, 2019 15:08:30 GMT -6
Thanks, mike! have you ever considered changing your shirt in your avatar pic to a black and white vertical stripe with a whistle around your neck? haha, just joking. I'm so glad you and all the mods do such a wonderful and conscientious job here. I've been on many forums and this is by far the best I've ever participated in. venge, I agree that the catholic church pretty much only consumes these goods, although it does have a large stake in the oil business, but I think a lot of economies would suffer if the catholic church ceased is consumption.
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Post by barbiosheepgirl on Apr 17, 2019 16:34:00 GMT -6
Well, this has turned into a discussion about who or what is Mystery Babylon. I want canada to focus on my point of Notre Dame as a FORESHADOWING, not an identification. I believe judgement will start in the House of God, just like Matt 23 and Jesus' frustration with the Pharisees, so today we have a bazillion denominations because man has complicated the Gospel. I see the city of mystery Babylon is just that, an entity of VARIOUS bondages, that ALL drink off or suffer from, INCLUDING the devout Believer. I see it has a combination of Economics, Religions, Politics (why it is a spiritual 'city' of high rises, business, streets, gutters, apartments, commerce, play (sports), all of that, and just life under this last Beast system (which carries Her) that Jesus will overturn when He begins to reign. We can pick and choose and criticize a religion, but Babylon equates to bondage, and ALL of us deal with our 'Hagar' momments now and then, yes, even us "saved' people.
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